won't that be great - Printable Version

won't that be great - Printable Version

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- amj - 03-24-2005

I just want to say, Abdul is 100% right,senior members, with all due respect, are getting personal with him, it will be much better if u give your opinion with logic instead of asking him to leave the forum. This is a general discussion forum and words written alongside are "Discuss whatever you like!". Tell u honestly i was laughing as well when i heard about mixed prayers. i wish that senior members who think that mix prayers are necessary come up with something supporting. it will be much beneficial for juniors like me. Honestly i am confused.

- sohana_is_back - 03-27-2005

HI JEE ME BACK
WELL ABDUL MAJID U R GREAT
NEVER MIND
I THINK U DONT KNOW THAT IN THIS FORUM THERE R SOME MAD PERSONS
ON KO KOCH AUR KAM TO ATA NAHI HA
AB DAKO MUJE HE LA LO MA NA ITNE ACHI POST TYPE KI TTII MAY BE AB 7 -8 PAGE PAR HO PAR KOCH KO ITNE JELEOUSY HOWE KA RAHA HE NAHI GAYA
RONAY LAG JATAY HAIN YA LOG
AUR AUR 1 -2 TO ASE BE HAIN JO ITNA ROTAY HAIN KA ADMININSTRATION KO EMAILS KAR KAR KA BLOCK KARWATAY HAIN
MUJE 6 DAFA BLOCK KARYAWA IN ROTAY HOWO NA
CHALO TEEK HA
WELL KEEP IT UP I AM MOVING UP SEE U

- abdulmajid - 03-28-2005

aha khan, you want to punch and then expect me to stand silent. that's not fair, mate.
you have accused me of making fun with religious issues, would you like to mention, which religious issue and how i have? it's a serious accusation, believe me.
ok, if i am not aware(lol) of something, would u like to create awareness on this forum about that thing. otherwise it will be safe to conclude that it's actually you who is ignorant. and what u have written in the end <blockquote id="quote">quote<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Should you have genuine queries, ask the way QUESTIONS are asked.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
interesting. you are funny khhan.

inta habieba omri, malikta omri

- Desert Sleet - 03-28-2005

<blockquote id="quote">quote<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by abdulmajid
 aha khan, you want to punch and then expect me to stand silent. that's not fair, mate.
you have accused me of making fun with religious issues, would you like to mention, which religious issue and how i have? it's a serious accusation, believe me.
ok, if i am not aware(lol) of something, would u like to create awareness on this forum about that thing. otherwise it will be safe to conclude that it's actually you who is ignorant. and what u have written in the end <blockquote id="quote">quote<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Should you have genuine queries, ask the way QUESTIONS are asked.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
interesting. you are funny khhan.

inta habieba omri, malikta omri
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Now you are trying fruitleslly to critisize Azeem. Let me clear you my point first regarding lying sack of Sh-it .

If it is claimed that someone is X and there is no evidence to back up that claim then the original claim is a fallacious argument. But if there is evidence then it is not. And it doesn't matter if X == brilliant, X == silly or X == dishonest. That is not a fallacious argument. Ad Hominem is an argument with no evidence simply accusations. I am not making an Ad Hominem argument. When a case is brought to court for fraud they are not making Ad Hominem arguments if they have evidence to back up their claims. If people do not want to be called liars then they need to make sure that they don't lie to people. They need to be honest. It has been my experience that when cheaters know that they can get away with cheating, they cheat. It is only when people call them on it that they realize that they canât get away with it and at least for interactions with that person they do not cheat. Liars are in that category. Calling them on their lying is what should be done. Letting them get away with their lies is what has gotten this country into this mess. When the President can make national statements that the jury is still out on evolution he is liar as well but no one will call him on it. But if I had the chance I certainly would. And of course, he lies because it is his ignorance about religion that makes him dishonest the same is the problem with you. Dear you are ignorant about the religion Islam.

---------------------------------------------
âLittle minds are tamed and subdued by misfortune; but great minds rise above it.â

- abdulmajid - 03-29-2005

<blockquote id="quote">quote<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">originally posted by desert sleight,
Now you are trying fruitleslly to critisize Azeem. Let me clear you my point first regarding lying sack of Sh-it .

If it is claimed that someone is X and there is no evidence to back up that claim then the original claim is a fallacious argument. But if there is evidence then it is not. And it doesn't matter if X == brilliant, X == silly or X == dishonest. That is not a fallacious argument. Ad Hominem is an argument with no evidence simply accusations. I am not making an Ad Hominem argument. When a case is brought to court for fraud they are not making Ad Hominem arguments if they have evidence to back up their claims. If people do not want to be called liars then they need to make sure that they don't lie to people. They need to be honest. It has been my experience that when cheaters know that they can get away with cheating, they cheat. It is only when people call them on it that they realize that they canât get away with it and at least for interactions with that person they do not cheat. Liars are in that category. Calling them on their lying is what should be done. Letting them get away with their lies is what has gotten this country into this mess. When the President can make national statements that the jury is still out on evolution he is liar as well but no one will call him on it. But if I had the chance I certainly would. And of course, he lies because it is his ignorance about religion that makes him dishonest the same is the problem with you. Dear you are ignorant about the religion Islam.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
see man, u are a mentle case, ok. if u are not satisfied read what i have written for u in the past, and keep reading it. each and every thing i have said for you is proving hundred% right. i am here to argue and discuss things not to waste my time with people who have pschological problems. i am telling u in clear words, don't expect any reply from me in future because i know now that u are a sick man ( i am sure u are a man, because a woman can't be that rediculous). already this person has wasted a lot of my time, always try to involve me in personal attacks. and then goes to the head master (administrator) or calls mummy (try to gather seniors for help).

inta habieba omri, malikta omri

- abdulmajid - 03-29-2005

i have written my point of view on this forum before. but as some sharp minds (there are so many of them around) were unable to understand[p], just because of their habbit of start personal abuses without reading anything (or they fear that someone is trying to subdue their presence). so i am trying once again to convey my humble opinion.
supporters of woman-led mix gathering prayers normally argue that
1. this is a symbolic gesture to present before the world, the discrimination against women even in worship places.
2. this is a vital step in abolishing the dependence of a muslim woman on men even in religious matters.
3. it's a struggle to get the equal rights with men. if a woman can offer her prayers in the imamat of a man then why can't a man do the same.
4. islam allowes prayers in the imammat of a woman.
i have found that those who don't support women-led mix gathering prayers argue that
1. it's not allowed in religion as most jurists of past and present agree that no prayer of men led by a woman is allowed, those jurist who support woman-led prayers like ibn taymiyya and perhaps al tabri and others think that woman can only lead her kin in a nafal (obligatory) prayer. however these scholars are in minority. even today no prominent scholar support it, egyptian scholars are mentioned in this regard, but almost all of them are of the opinion that a woman can lead other women but not men.
2. prayers are included in haqooq ullah (rights of allah), so these rights should be fulfilled as allah himself has required, without bothering which sex is being given the superiority in this regard. there are other ways of showing symbolic gestures. can a women take the place of pope??
3. what if women start leading men in prayers, will it improve the state of women is our societies. the real cause of injustice with women should be adressed.
4. mix gatherings, will definitly lead to other social evils. ( what u think!!!!)
i have honeslty tried to present what both the sides think, without going into detail. if any one wants to know the detail then he or she can use internet. but it's obvious that people who don't support congregations with mix gatherings have much more solid grounds. (give your opinion then we will see why their arguements are stronger)
i have always felt that so called activists of women rights are not sincere, they only create a hype to get funds and recognition, as track record of ms.nomani suggests. my personal opinion (as i have mentioned before in my previous post, and hope members will agree) is that state of women will only improve if we are prepared to address two areas
1. more and better education to both men and women, especailly religious education so misconceptions about our great religion are removed and people know what rights women have.
2. better work place environment for women. it also includes the ease with which they can reach and come back from their work place. and the environement of workplace i.e women are not just treated as show pieces in offices, they get equal opportunities of promotion, respect from male colleagues. for this purpose it will much better if more and more women-only organisations are formed so women can feel how to do work in equal opportunity environment.
and offcourse there are other areas of concern too, like easy access to justice etc. but these are the real issues which should be adressed to help women in achieving their due status in muslim societies. and non- issues like woman-led mix gathering congreagations are diverting attention from real issues and helping no one except fame-hungry greedy individuals.

p.s. if i don't reply for 2 or 3 days, don't feel over excited becasue i could have some other things to do. and keep in mind, all written above is my humble personal opinion, i may be wrong or may be right. that's what i admit[)]

inta habieba omri, malikta omri

- abdulmajid - 03-29-2005

<blockquote id="quote">quote<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">as posted by sam
Abdul Majid and Sohana if you are on this forum to commit illegal moral crimes believe me that is not going to happen ,but if you really insist on going further in enmity and hatred believe me that I will be the one to face it and demolish all kinds of your Negatives,But it would be better if you not do what you are in habit to do because you will have to pay a lot , then you will discuss that on this forum what happened...
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
jagga lagga ein[8D], don't know why u changed your tone in last sentence <blockquote id="quote">quote<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Get on with this forum with PEACE brother and sister<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">[?]

inta habieba omri, malikta omri

- Desert Sleet - 03-29-2005

<blockquote id="quote">quote<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by abdulmajid
see man, u are a mentle case, ok. if u are not satisfied read what i have written for u in the past, and keep reading it. each and every thing i have said for you is proving hundred% right. i am here to argue and discuss things not to waste my time with people who have pschological problems. i am telling u in clear words, don't expect any reply from me in future because i know now that u are a sick man ( i am sure u are a man, because a woman can't be that rediculous). already this person has wasted a lot of my time, always try to involve me in personal attacks. and then goes to the head master (administrator) or calls mummy (try to gather seniors for help).

inta habieba omri, malikta omri
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
As I wrote in the other thread, I want the members to have an understanding of the monstrous nature of Abdul his complete lack of common moral ground with the rest of humanity. I don't suppose Abdul is truly of the same complexion as the sociopath we call . I think the administration here has a blind spot for him, because he consistently writes non-sequiturs to debate and slurs of others without visible consequence. I have nothing to do with the management of this site, but it is one of the most glaring errors of this otherwise fruitful location, to overlook Abdul outrageous behavior. Maybe they find it amusing....

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âLittle minds are tamed and subdued by misfortune; but great minds rise above it.â

- CBPian - 03-29-2005

Well I'd say that it is important that freedom of speech of this forum is preserved.
There has been consistent use of irresponsible language from both sides, which should be restrained, however it would be unfair to believe that abdulmajid meant any harm to the religion, it is clear that it was humor although maybe beyond the tolerable limit of some readers. Its fortunate that we listen to even extreme type of humor on the late night shows and swallow it.
Tolerance is the essence of today's society and if someone's opinion does not support violence, I do not see why it should be ostracized.

http//s4.invisionfree.com/AccountingWorld/

- Azeem Shah Khan - 03-30-2005

<blockquote id="quote">quote<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by abdulmajid
 aha khan, you want to punch and then expect me to stand silent. that's not fair, mate.
you have accused me of making fun with religious issues, would you like to mention, which religious issue and how i have? it's a serious accusation, believe me.
ok, if i am not aware(lol) of something, would u like to create awareness on this forum about that thing. otherwise it will be safe to conclude that it's actually you who is ignorant. and what u have written in the end <blockquote id="quote">quote<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Should you have genuine queries, ask the way QUESTIONS are asked.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

interesting. you are funny khhan.

inta habieba omri, malikta omri
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Dear Abdul Majid

I am scared. Please dont say anything to me, should you wish I can go back and delete my post and if that can stop you from expressing your OWN belief in a way which can hurt the feelings of many.

<blockquote id="quote">quote<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">well it would be great if two ladies (below 35) are on my sides while offering a namaz bajamat, lol (agar paon aur kandhey na milaey jaein to namaz nahien hoti) if they are pretty, to kia kehney; if they are ugly, then
a perfect prayer with so much concentration.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

A person like me would never like such kind of humour involving NAMAZ. Its not that I am not getting the msg behind it, it is the expression that is degrading NAMAZ. It might not be for you, but it is for me.

<blockquote id="quote">quote<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">i am sure that nassef & co. have stolen MY idea, i was the first after imam ibn arabi (that londey baaz imam) to think this great way of offering prayers, believe me. I was 12 when i used to think that way, but alas!!! what i can say now (jab chirrian chug gaien khet). But no need to get panic, i have some other ideas that copy cats nassef and asra can't think in their lives, offcourse copied from those greats shibli (not shibli nomani) and ibn arabi and that mansoor.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Referring an Imam in such a pathetic way clearly shows the level of your own TOLERANCE. No matter which sect you belong to or whther you are correct or not, your expression is once again deplorable.

<blockquote id="quote">quote<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">thanks to allah all of them are now dead, so they will have no problem if some one smart like me steal their ideas. hope nassef & co. are not that ambitious.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Brother, it is very easy to humiliate others. Please beware that it is a forum where members belong to different religions, sects and maslaks. Your comments are not only disgraceful but they can also instigate hatred between us.

I dont know if you are going to treat my message as a punch or an advise. I hope you go for the later.

I am not an Aalim nor a scholar, I might not have enough knowledge, I might not be able to answer your queries (if you have any) but it doesn't mean I will tolerate any demeaning remarks about Islam.

Once again I extend my offer to discuss your queries about this or anyother topic, if asked respectfully.

Best regards

"You don't get to choose how you're going to die. Or when. You can only decide how you're going to live. Now."

- Pracs - 03-30-2005

Unfortunately What I see here is a case of ''idle mind'' thing with Abdul Majid...... He's just acting like a spoil brat who pines for attention by heaving slur at his parents.... and then throwing tantrums !

- abdulmajid - 03-31-2005

dear azeem shah khan!
a person do a thing secretly, people find that out and charge him as criminal. but there are some lucky people who do the same thing a bit openly and people refer to that as a part of tasawoff. (don't want to go in detail, because that will hurt)
and i certainly have mocked a few jokers who staged a drama in new york. never degraded namaz. that drama wasn't a namaz, i believe.
HOW I AM INTOLERANT?
i am not trying or asking people to stop others from practicing their beliefs. every one should practice what he or she believes to be true. intolerance is if somebody preaches to stop by force other people from preaching their religious beliefs. if i am just giving my opinion and refering it to as my personal thoughts then no body should feel hurt. because these are just my personal thoughts. ok, was prophet MOHAMMED (pbuh) and other prophets (A.S) were intolerant, when prohet Mhammed (pbuh) used to criticise the religious beliefs of people of Makkah, was he intolerant?? He just used to argue, never intended to use force. and even after the conquest of Makka, He didn't forced anybody to convert to islam. I am not at all saying that i am fighting a kufr against islam war. if i mock people who support mix congreagations, it doesn't mean i am saying that they are bound for hell. i am just trying to convey is that i don't agree with them, and there belief that mix-gathering jummah prayers under a woman's imamat are allowed is just a joke.
and there are other things which were quite irrelevent to the topic, but still were true; i have already said sorry for that. because this is not a place to discuss those things. I would repeat again that if somebody's feelings are hurt (thought they should never be, because these are just my personal opion) i can only feel sorry.

p.s. u seems to have that habbit of repeating clumsy jokes. still thanks for talking in a bit sensible way. and hope u won't get personal with me.

inta habieba omri, malikta omri

- Desert Sleet - 03-31-2005

<blockquote id="quote">quote<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by sohana11
 <blockquote id="quote">quote<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by sam
 for Desert Sleet who is still the best member i would say to please ignore them as nonignorance would lead to provacation of similar kinds of acts
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itna bara joooooooooooooooooot
toba

<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Sohana, I've noticed you seem to be acting as the village critic. Everyone who posts something odd-beat gets a stupid comment from you.

Don't you have something worthwhile to do? (making posts about foods, fliritng and apetite isnt worthwhile, if you were wondering)

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âLittle minds are tamed and subdued by misfortune; but great minds rise above it.â

- Azeem Shah Khan - 04-02-2005

<blockquote id="quote">quote<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by abdulmajid
 dear azeem shah khan!
a person do a thing secretly, people find that out and charge him as criminal. but there are some lucky people who do the same thing a bit openly and people refer to that as a part of tasawoff. (don't want to go in detail, because that will hurt)
and i certainly have mocked a few jokers who staged a drama in new york. never degraded namaz. that drama wasn't a namaz, i believe.
HOW I AM INTOLERANT?
i am not trying or asking people to stop others from practicing their beliefs. every one should practice what he or she believes to be true. intolerance is if somebody preaches to stop by force other people from preaching their religious beliefs. if i am just giving my opinion and refering it to as my personal thoughts then no body should feel hurt. because these are just my personal thoughts. ok, was prophet MOHAMMED (pbuh) and other prophets (A.S) were intolerant, when prohet Mhammed (pbuh) used to criticise the religious beliefs of people of Makkah, was he intolerant?? He just used to argue, never intended to use force. and even after the conquest of Makka, He didn't forced anybody to convert to islam. I am not at all saying that i am fighting a kufr against islam war. if i mock people who support mix congreagations, it doesn't mean i am saying that they are bound for hell. i am just trying to convey is that i don't agree with them, and there belief that mix-gathering jummah prayers under a woman's imamat are allowed is just a joke.
and there are other things which were quite irrelevent to the topic, but still were true; i have already said sorry for that. because this is not a place to discuss those things. I would repeat again that if somebody's feelings are hurt (thought they should never be, because these are just my personal opion) i can only feel sorry.

p.s. u seems to have that habbit of repeating clumsy jokes. still thanks for talking in a bit sensible way. and hope u won't get personal with me.

inta habieba omri, malikta omri
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Just for you, I am gonna write without CLUMSY jokes.

We don't live in a perfect world, it was never perfect and never will be. We must learn to live our own lives the way we want and let others follow whatever they believe in.

I never mentioned your other post about the New York interview, so leave that topic aside.

Brother, no-body can stop no-one, I dont agree with how you define Intolerance. Force has nothing to do with it.

I am not stopping you from having a constructive discussion. With your intellectual vocab, extreme respect for scholars of different school of thought and amazing sense of humour, I am afraid nobody will ever want to discuss anything. Go back and see what I wrote in my first post Ask questions the way they are asked.

I have no problem with your belief. All you need is the right way to express your-self which must include tolerance for other views and respect for other scholars. I dont think you need to be a genius to understand what I am saying.

I dont like to personally attack anyone, I have no intentions to do with you. However, I respond aggressively to any crap so do some other members, you know whom I am talking about. "Be careful" is all I can suggest you.

Now its your turn to come up with some SENSIBLE stuff (as you call it).

I would request DS and Zubair to calm down and see what Majid has got to offer us.

Kind regards

"You don't get to choose how you're going to die. Or when. You can only decide how you're going to live. Now."

- abdulmajid - 04-02-2005

<blockquote id="quote">quote<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"> posted by azeem shah khan
I would request DS and Zubair to calm down and see what Majid has got to offer us.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
i have already posted what ever i have to say in the topic, "they have nothing" you can refer to that.[D] and as i am 50%sure that you don't know what i am saying, like other members, so you are not gonna reply reply there[D]

inta habieba omri, malikta omri