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+--- Thread: Episode # 1: Bus Mgmt Vs Business Analysis! (/thread-episode-1-bus-mgmt-vs-business-analysis)
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Episode # 1: Bus Mgmt Vs Business Analysis! - Muhammad Amir - 04-20-2008
Episode # 1 CA Module âEâ E-17 âBusiness Managementâ Vs ACCA âProfessional Levelâ P-3 âBusiness Analysisâ.
Look at these papers in the perspectives of paper pattern, assessment criteria and marking scheme.
I am comparing winter (December) 2006 paper of âBusiness Managementâ with December 2007 paper of âBusiness Analysisâ.
At the end of the topic I will post the differences between paper pattern, assessment criteria and marking schemes of both bodies.
So lets start with CA Module âEâ âBusiness Managementâ paper.
Q.1 (a) <font color="red"><b>What do you understand</b></font id="red"> by the concept of Ethical Marketing? (02)
What possible ethical issues do you see in the following areas?
-Fixing of prices in collaboration with competitors.
-Premium pricing for brands versus unbranded generic products.
-Advertising. (06)
(b) Employees are important stakeholders and responsible organizations lay down
appropriate rules/principles to govern their conduct towards the employees. <font color="red"><b>Give
any four examples</b></font id="red"> which you consider important for inclusion in the Code of
Ethics relating to employer and employee relationship. (08)
Q.2 Sterling Corporation is an integrated manufacturing and marketing concern dealing in
industrial chemicals. The company employs a large number of staff which is mainly
engaged in manufacturing, office support services and outdoor sales. The occupational
health and safety record of the company has been quite poor with regular incidents
occurring across the organisation. Typical incidents reported are
- Factory Floor Inhalation of toxic fumes; cuts & burns in handling machines;
slips and falls due to poor housekeeping.
- Office Ergonomic ailments due to poorly designed furniture; eyesight
impairment due to extended hours of computer work.
- Road Travel Road accidents and resulting injuries.
The management has woken up to the need to improve health and safety performance of
its employees. It wants to champion zero-tolerance for unsafe and unhealthy work
practices and understands that this requires joint ownership of responsibility by
management and employees.
You are assigned to
- Draft a Corporate Health & Safety Policy statement stating the managementâs
vision and everyoneâs responsibilities. (03)
- <font color="red"><b>Recommend some safety measures</b></font id="red"> to be undertaken by the company for the
employees to help reduce accidents. (03)
- <font color="red"><b>Suggest some measures</b></font id="red">, against which to monitor safety performance in the
following three areas
------- Factory Floor
------- Office
------- Road Travel (06)
Q.3 Despite the proven advantages of specialisation in terms of gaining comparative
advantage, many countries actively try to avoid specialising their economies. What
might be some of the arguments against pursuit of specialisation? (08)
Q.4 Marketing Research is a powerful tool that helps in improving the quality of marketing
decisions. There are different approaches available to pre-test a marketing idea or
strategy. Some of these pre-testing tools are
⢠Motivational Research
⢠Laboratory Tests
⢠Ratings Tests
⢠Test Marketing
⢠Simulated Store Technique
⢠Controlled Test Marketing
<b><font color="red">Describe any four</font id="red"></b> of the above types of pre-tests. (08)
Q.5 (a) <b><font color="red">What is meant by forecasting</font id="red"></b> and why is it done by business managers? (02)
(b) <font color="red"><b>What may be the most common reasons for failures in forecasting?</b></font id="red"> (03)
Q.6 (a)<font color="red"> Why, in your opinion</font id="red">, are properly designed <font color="red">Job Application Forms</font id="red"> important and
<font color="red">what is their main purpose</font id="red">? (03)
(b) <font color="red"><b>What are the main objectives</b></font id="red"> of undertaking Performance Appraisal exercises at
regular intervals? (06)
Q.7 Ahmer and Company manufactures and markets motor cycles in Pakistan. It has started
facing severe price competition from some of the new entrants in the industry. Some of
the competitorsâ prices are very low according to the company. These new entrants are
mostly local companies which operate with Chinese collaboration. They are attempting
to change the rules of the game by bringing in new model of business focusing on âBest
Cost Strategyâ. Ahmer, the owner of the company is quite concerned about this
situation. It is putting pressure on both profitability and market share of his company.
He can manage some cost reduction by better negotiation with his existing vendors and
component manufacturers but these do not seem sufficient to fight against the new
competition. He is of the opinion that he cannot compromise on quality to the extent that
it earns his brand a bad name in the market.
(a) Please make a brief assessment of the above situation highlighting the importance
of cost management as an on going activity of organizational strategic fit. (03)
(b) What other options do you think Ahmer has, to fight the new competition? Please
present a case to Ahmer for strategic cost management to make a breakthrough. (08)
Q.8 Research proves that most successful companies have âPurpose Beyond Profitâ which
give them better return on investment and shareholder value.
(a) <font color="red">Explain your understanding of the concept of âPurpose Beyond Profitâ.</font id="red"> (03)
(b) <font color="red"><b>Give three examples</b></font id="red"> of purpose beyond profit which a business organization could
have. (03)
Q.9 Many top executives believe in âConstant Re Inventionâ, as they remark, âthe minute
you have developed a new business model, itâs extinct, because somebody is going to
copy itâ. Hence, the organizations should develop Sustainable Competitive Advantage
(SCA).
(a) <font color="red">What do you understand by Sustainable Competitive Advantage? Explain.</font id="red"> (03)
(b) How can product innovation and technology up gradation result in developing an
SCA? (03)
(c) In the context of product development, <b><font color="red">list the different types of ânew productsâ? </font id="red"> </b> (03)
(d) <font color="red"><b>List various sources of ânew productsâ</b>.</font id="red"> (03)
(e) While bringing a new product in the market, what important marketing
considerations should be taken into account to make it successful? <font color="red">Explain briefly</font id="red">. (03)
Q.10 <font color="red">What are global (multi-national) companies?</font id="red"> What are the different threats and
opportunities these companies face? Please <font color="red">explain briefly.</font id="red"> (10)
(THE END)
So, you have seen this paper and its marking scheme now lets see the criteria of ACCA âProfessional Levelâ P-3 âBusiness Analysisâ paper.
- Muhammad Amir - 04-20-2008
Section A â This ONE question is compulsory and MUST be attempted
The following information should be used when answering question 1.
1 Introduction
The island of Oceania attracts thousands of tourists every year. They come to enjoy the beaches, the climate and to explore the architecture and history of this ancient island. Oceania is also an important trading nation in the region and it enjoys close economic links with neighbouring countries. Oceania has four main airports and until 1997 had two airlines, one based in the west (OceaniaAir) and one based in the east (Transport Oceania) of the island. However, in 1997 these two airlines merged into one airline â Oceania National Airlines (ONA) with the intention of exploiting the booming growth in business and leisure travel to and from Oceania.
Market sectors ONA serves two main sectors. The first sector is a network of routes to the major cities of neighbouring countries.
ONA management refer to this as the regional sector. The average flight time in this sector is one and a half hours and most flights are timed to allow business people to arrive in time to attend a meeting and then to return to their homes in the evening. Twenty five major cities are served in the regional sector with, on average, three return flights per day. There is also significant leisure travel, with many families visiting relatives in the region. The second sector is what ONA management refer to as the international sector. This is a network of flights to continental capitals. The average flight time in this sector is four hours. These flights attract both business and leisure travellers. The leisure travellers are primarily holiday-makers from the continent. Twenty cities are served in this sector with, on average, one return flight per day to each city.
Image, service and employment ONA is the airline of choice for most of the citizens of Oceania. A recent survey suggested that 90% of people preferred to travel ONA for regional flights and 70% preferred to travel with ONA for international flights. 85% of the respondents were proud of their airline and felt that it projected a positive image of Oceania. The company also has an excellent safety record, with no fatal accident recorded since the merging of the airlines in 1997. The customer service of ONA has also been recognised by the airline industry itself. In 2005 it was voted Regional Airline of the Year by the International Passenger Group (IPG) and one year later the IPG awarded the ONA catering department the prestigious Golden Bowl as provider of the best airline food in the world. The courtesy and motivation of its employees (mainly Oceanic residents) is recognised throughout the region. 95% of ONA employees belong to recognised trade unions. ONA is perceived as an excellent employer. It pays above industry average salaries, offers excellent benefits (such as free health care) and has a generous non-contributory pension scheme. In 2004 ONA employed 5400 people, rising to 5600 in 2005 and 5800 in 2006.
Fleet
Fleet details are given in Table 1. Nineteen of the Boeing 737s were originally in the fleet of OceaniaAir. Boeing 737s
are primarily used in the international sector. Twenty-three of the Airbus A320s were originally part of the Transport
Oceania fleet. Airbuses are primarily used in the regional sector. ONA also used three Embraer RJ145 jets in the
regional sector.
Table 1 Fleet details
Boeing 737 Airbus A320 Embraer RJ145
Total aircraft in service
2006 21 27 3
2005 21 27 3
2004 20 26 2
Capacity (passengers) 147 149 50
Introduced October 1991 November 1988 January 1999
Average age 12·1 years 12·9 years 6·5 years
Utilisation (hrs per day) 8·70 7·41 7·50
Performance Since 2004 ONA has begun to experience significant competition from âno frillsâ low-cost budget airlines, particularly in the international sector. Established continental operators now each offer, on average, three low fares flights to Oceania every day. âNo frillsâ low-cost budget airlines are also having some impact on the regional sector. A number of very small airlines (some with only one aircraft) have been established in some regional capitals and a few of these
are offering low-cost flights to Oceania. A recent survey for ONA showed that its average international fare was double that of its low-cost competitors. Some of the key operational statistics for 2006 are summarised in Table 2.
Table 2 Key operational statistics for ONA in 2006
Low-cost Regional International Competitor
Average Contribution to revenue ($m)
Passenger 400 280 Not applicable
Cargo 35 15 Not applicable
Passenger load factor
Standard Class 73% 67% 87%
Business Class 90% 74% 75%
Average annual pilot salary $106,700 $112,500 $96,500
Source of revenue
On-line sales 40% 60% 84%
Direct sales 10% 5% 12%
Commission sales 50% 35% 4%
Average age of aircraft See Table 1 4.5 years
Utilisation (hrs per day) See Table 1 9·10
ONA have made a number of operational changes in the last few years. Their website, for example, now allows passengers to book over the internet and to either have their tickets posted to them or to pick them up at the airport prior to travelling. Special promotional fares are also available for customers who book on-line. However, the website does not currently allow passengers to check-in on-line, a facility provided by some competitors. Furthermore, as Table 2 shows, a large percentage of sales are still commission sales made through travel agents. Direct sales are those sales made over the telephone or at the airport itself. Most leisure travellers pay standard or economy fares and travel in the standard class section of the plane. Although many business travellers also travel in standard class, some of them choose to travel business class for which they pay a price premium.
In the last three years, the financial performance of ONA has not matched its operational success. The main financial indicators have been extracted and are presented in Table 3. In a period (2004â2006) when world-wide passenger air travel revenue increased by 12% (and revenue from air travel to Oceania by 15%) and cargo revenue by 10%, ONA only recorded a 4·6% increase in passenger revenue.
Table 3 Extracted Financial Information
all figures in $m
Extracted from the Balance Sheet
Non-current assets 2006 2005 2004
Property, plant and equipment 788 785 775
Other non-current assets 60 56 64
Total 848 841 839
Current assets
Inventories 8 7 7
Trade receivables 68 71 69
Cash and cash equivalents 289 291 299
Total 365 369 375
Total assets 1213 1210 1214
Total shareholdersâ equity 250 259 264
Non-current liabilities
Interest bearing long-term loans 310 325 335
Employee benefit obligations 180 178 170
Other provisions 126 145 143
Total non-current liabilities 616 648 648
Current liabilities
Trade payables 282 265 255
Current tax payable 9 12 12
Other current liabilities 56 26 35
Total current liabilities 347 303 302
Total equity and liabilities 1213 1210 1214
Extracted from the income statement
Revenue
Passenger 680 675 650
Cargo 50 48 45
Other revenue 119 112 115
Total 849 835 810
Cost of Sales
Purchases 535 525 510
Total 535 525 510
Gross Profit 314 310 300
Wages & Salaries 215 198 187
Directorsâ Salaries 17 16 15
Interest payable 22 21 18
Total 254 235 220
Net Profit before tax 60 75 80
Tax Expense 18 23 24
Net Profit after tax 42 52 56
Future Strategy
The management team at ONA are keen to develop a strategy to address the airlineâs financial and operational weaknesses. One suggestion has been to re-position ONA itself as a âno frillsâ low-cost budget airline. However, this has been angrily dismissed by the CEO as likely to lead âto an unnecessary and bloody revolution that could cause the death of the airline itself â.
Required
(a) <font color="purple">Using the information provided in the scenario, <b>evaluate </b> the strengths and weaknesses</font id="purple"> of ONA and their impact on its performance. Please note that opportunities and threats are NOT required in your evaluation. (20 marks)
(b) The CEO of Oceania National Airways (ONA) has already strongly rejected the re-positioning of ONA as a âno frillsâ low-cost budget airline.
(i) <font color="purple"><b>Explain the key features</b> of a âno frillsâ low-cost strategy.</font id="purple"> (4 marks)
(ii) <font color="purple"><b>Analyse</b></font id="purple"> why moving to a âno frillsâ low-cost <font color="purple"><b>strategy would be inappropriate for ONA.</b></font id="purple">
Note requirement (b) (ii) <font color="purple"><b>includes 3 professional marks</b> </font id="purple"> (16 marks)
(c)<font color="purple"> <b>Identify and evaluate other strategic options</b> </font id="purple"> ONA could consider to address the <font color="purple"><b>airlineâs current financial and operational weaknesses.</b></font id="purple">
Note <font color="purple"><b>requirement (c) includes 2 professional marks </b> </font id="purple"> (10 marks)
(50 marks)
Section B â TWO questions ONLY to be attempted
2 A clothing company sells 40% of its goods directly to customers through its website. The marketing manager of the company (MM) has decided that this is insufficient and has put a small team together to re-design the site. MM feels that the site looks âamateur and old-fashioned and does not project the right imageâ. The board of the company has given the go-ahead for the MM âto re-design the websiteâ. The following notes summarise the outcomes of the meetings on the website re-design. The team consists of the marketing manager (MM), a product range manager (RP), a marketing image consultant (IC) and a technical developer (TD). Meeting 1 9 July attended by MM, RP, IC and TD The need for a re-designed website to increase sales volume through the website and to âimprove our market visibilityâ was explained by MM. IC was asked to produce a draft design.
Meeting 2 16 August attended by MM, RP, IC and TD, IC presented a draft design. MM and RP were happy with its image but not its functionality, suggesting that it was too similar to the current site. âWe expected it to do much moreâ was their view.
Meeting 3 4 September attended by MM, RP and IC, IC produced a re-drafted design. This overall design was agreed and the go-ahead was given for TD to produce a prototype of the design to show to the board.
Meeting 4 11 September attended by RP, IC and TD, TD explained that elements of the drafted re-design were not technically feasible to implement in the programming language being used. Changes to the design were agreed at the meeting to overcome these issues and signed off by
RP.
Meeting 5 13 October attended by MM, RP, IC and TD, The prototype re-design was demonstrated by TD. MM was unhappy with the re-design as it was âmoving too far away
from the original objective and lacked functionality that should be thereâ. TD agreed to write a technical report to explain why the original design (agreed on 4 September) could not be adhered to.
Meeting 6 9 November attended by MM, IC and TD
It was agreed to return to the 4 September design with slight alterations to make it technically feasible. TD expressed concerns that the suggested design would not work properly with all web browsers. At the board meeting of 9 December the board expressed concern about the time taken to produce the re-design and the finance director highlighted the rising costs (currently $25,000) of the project. They asked MM to produce a formal cost-benefit of the re-design. The board were also concerned that the scope of the project, which they had felt to be about re-design, had somehow been interpreted as including development and implementation.
On 22 December MM produced the following cost-benefit analysis of the project and confirmed that the word âredesignâ had been interpreted as including the development and implementation of the website. Year 1 Year 2 Year 3 Year 4 Year 5
Costs $50,000 $10,000 $10,000 $10,000 $10,000
*Benefits 0 $15,000 $25,000 $35,000 $35,000
*These benefits are extra sales volumes created by the websiteâs extra functionality and the companyâs increased visibility in the market place.
On 4 January the board gave the go ahead for the development and implementation of the website with a further budget of $25,000 and a delivery date of 1 March. TD expressed concern that he did not have enough developers to deliver the re-designed website on time.
Meeting 7 24 February attended by MM, RP, IC and TD. A partial prototype system was demonstrated by TD. RP felt that the functionality of the re-design was too limited and
that the software was not robust enough. It had crashed twice during the demonstration. He suggested that the company delay the introduction of the re-designed website until it was complete and robust. MM declared this to be impossible.
Conclusion
The re-designed website was launched on 1 March. MM declared the re-design a success that âhad come in on time and under budgetâ. On 2 and 3 March, numerous complaints were received from customers. The website was unreliable and did not work with a particular popular web browser. On 4 March an emergency board meeting decided to withdraw the site and reinstate the old one. On 5 March, MM resigned.
Required
Most project management methods have an initiation or definition stage which includes the production of a document
that serves as an agreement between the sponsors and deliverers of the project. This may be called a project initiation
document or a project charter. Defining the business case is also an important part of the initiation or definition stage
of the project.
(a) <font color="purple">Explain how a business case and a project initiation document would have helped prevent some of the
problems that emerged during the conduct of the website re-design project.</font id="purple"> (15 marks)
(b) <font color="purple">Analyse how effective project management could have further improved both the process and the outcomes
of the website re-design project.</font id="purple"> (10 marks)
(25 marks)
3 Local neighbourhood shops are finding it increasingly difficult to compete with supermarkets. However, three years ago, the Perfect Shopper franchise group was launched that allowed these neighbourhood shops to join the group and achieve cost savings on tinned and packaged goods, particularly groceries. Perfect Shopper purchases branded goods in bulk from established food suppliers and stores them in large purpose-built warehouses, each designed to serve a geographical region. When Perfect Shopper was established it decided that deliveries to these warehouses should be made by the food suppliers or by haulage contractors working on behalf of these suppliers. Perfect Shopper places orders with these suppliers and the supplier arranges the delivery to the warehouse. These arrangements are still in place. Perfect Shopper has no branded goods of its own.
Facilities are available in each warehouse to re-package goods into smaller units, more suitable for the requirements of the neighbourhood shop. These smaller units, typically containing 50â100 tins or packs, are usually small trays, sealed with strong transparent polythene. Perfect Shopper delivers these to its neighbourhood shops using specialist haulage contractors local to the regional warehouse. Perfect Shopper has negotiated significant discounts with suppliers, part of which it passes on to its franchisees. A recent survey in a national grocery magazine showed that
franchisees saved an average of 10% on the prices they would have paid if they had purchased the products directly from the manufacturer or from an intermediary â such as cash and carry wholesalers.
As well as offering savings due to bulk buying, Perfect Shopper also provides, as part of its franchise
(i) Personalised promotional material. This usually covers specific promotions and is distributed locally, either using specialist leaflet distributors or loosely inserted into local free papers or magazines.
(ii) Specialised signage for the shops to suggest the image of a national chain. The signs include the Perfect Shopper slogan âthe nationâs localâ.
(iii) Specialist in-store display units for certain goods, again branded with the Perfect Shopper logo. Perfect Shopper does not provide all of the goods required by a neighbourhood shop. Consequently, it is not an exclusive franchise. Franchisees agree to purchase specific products through Perfect Shopper, but other goods, such as vegetables, fruit, stationery and newspapers they source from elsewhere. Deliveries are made every two weeks to franchisees using a standing order for products agreed between the franchisee and their Perfect Shopper sales
representative at a meeting they hold every three months. Variations to this order can be made by telephone, but only if the order is increased. Downward variations are not allowed. Franchisees cannot reduce their standing order requirements until the next meeting with their representative.
Perfect Shopper was initially very successful, but its success has been questioned by a recent independent report that showed increasing discontent amongst franchisees. The following issues were documented.
(i) The need to continually review prices to compete with supermarkets
(ii) Low brand recognition of Perfect Shopper
(iii) Inflexible ordering and delivery system based around forecasts and restricted ability to vary orders (see above)
As a result of this survey, Perfect Shopper has decided to review its business model. Part of this review is to reexamine
the supply chain, to see if there are opportunities for addressing some of its problems.
Required
(a) Describe the primary activities of the value chain of Perfect Shopper. (5 marks)
(b) <font color="purple">Explain how Perfect Shopper might re-structure its upstream supply chain to address the problems <b>identified in the scenario.</b></font id="purple"> (10 marks)
(c) <font color="purple">Explain how Perfect Shopper might re-structure its downstream supply chain to address the problems <b>identified in the scenario. </b> </font id="purple"> (10 marks)
(25 marks)
4 The country of Europia has an extensive historical and industrial heritage. It has many tourist sites (such as castles, palaces, temples, houses and factories) which attract visitors from home and abroad. Most of these tourist sites have gift shops where visitors can buy mementos and souvenirs of their visit. These souvenirs often include cups, saucers, plates and other items which feature a printed image of the particular tourist site.
The Universal Pottery Company (UPC) is the main supplier of these pottery souvenir items to the tourist trade. It produces the items in its potteries and then applies the appropriate image using specialised image printing machines.
UPC also supplies other organisations that require personalised products. For example, it recently won the right to produce souvenirs for the Eurasian Games, which are being held in Europia in two years time. UPC currently ships about 250,000 items of pottery out of its factory every month. Most of these items are shipped in relatively small packages. All collections from the factory and deliveries to customers are made by a nationwide courier company.
In the last two years there has been a noticeable increase in the number of complaints about the quality of these items. The complaints, from gift shop owners, concentrate on two main issues
(i) The physical condition of goods when they arrive at the gift shop. Initial evidence suggests that âa significant number of products are now arriving broken, chipped or crackedâ. These items are unusable and they have to be returned to UPC. UPC management are convinced that the increased breakages are due to packers not following the correct packing method.
(ii) Incorrect alignment of the image of the tourist site on the selected item. For example, a recent batch of 100 cups for Carish Castle included 10 cups where the image of the castle sloped significantly from left to right. These were returned by the customer and destroyed by UPC.
The image problem was investigated in more depth and it was discovered that approximately 500 items were delivered every month with misaligned images. Each item costs, on average, $20 to produce.
As a result of these complaints, UPC appointed a small quality inspection team who were asked to inspect one in every 20 packages for correct packaging and correct image alignment. However, although some problems have been found, a significant number of defective products have still been delivered to customers. A director of UPC used this evidence to support his assertion that the âquality inspection team is just not workingâ.
The payment system for packers has also been such an issue. It was established ten years ago as an attempt to boost productivity. Packers receive a bonus for packing more than a target number of packages per hour. Hence, packers are more concerned with the speed of packing rather than its quality.
Finally, there is also evidence that to achieve agreed customer deadlines, certain managers have asked the quality inspection team to overlook defective items so that order deadlines could be met.
The company has decided to review the quality issue again. The director who claimed that the quality inspection team is not working has suggested using a Six Sigma approach to the companyâs quality problems.
Required
(a) <font color="purple">Analyse the current and potential role of quality, quality control and quality assurance <b>at UPC</b>. </font id="purple"> (15 marks)
(b) <font color="purple"><b>Examine</b> how adopting a Six Sigma approach would help address the quality problems <b>at UPC</b>.</font id="purple"> (10 marks)
(25 marks)
- Muhammad Amir - 04-20-2008
BMG(Business Management) is the most absurd paper i have ever seen in my life.
<b>
Module 'E' Students are asked to
1)Define Ethical Marketing? 2 Marks
2)Recommend some safety measures! 3 Marks
3)Q.5===>(a) What is meant by forecasting and why is it done by business managers? 2 Marks
========>(b) What may be the most common reasons for failures in forecasting? 3 Marks
4)Q.6=======> (a) Why, in your opinion, are properly designed Job Application Forms important and what is their main purpose? 3 Marks
============>(b)What are the main objectives of undertaking Performance Appraisal exercises at regular intervals? 6 Marks
5)==========>(a)Explain your understanding of the concept of âPurpose Beyond Profitâ. 3 Marks
============>(b) Give three examples of purpose beyond profit which a business organization could have. 3 Marks
6)(c) In the context of product development, list the different types of ânew productsâ? 3 Marks
7) List various sources of ânew productsâ. 3 Marks
8)==>Q.10 What are global (multi-national) companies? What are the different threats and opportunities these companies face? Please explain briefly. 10 Marks.
</b>
So, see by your own eyes that what is the level of this exam and Marks on offer, moreover Module 'E' Students are asked to define Multi National Companies and Threats and Opportunities for MNCs for 10 Marks!!!!!!!!!!![0]
On the other hand ACCA Paper P3 Business Analysis provide you with more than 1000 words scenario worth 50 Marks and three separate scenarios they are also of more than one page woth 25 marks and then asks to evaluate, assess and determine in accordance with a particular scenario they are not just asked to produce list, explain, briefly explain and define. OUR ACCA's level is much more than this define, Lists, Briefly Explain.
Marking Scheme of ACCA papers is also very strict they are not offered to eat 8 marks on Internal Control and 10 Marks on Multinational Companies' Definition.
- Abdur.Rehman - 04-27-2008
But Mr. Amir the ground reality is that even if u pass the whole ACCA, u dont get exemption of this paper and another ground reality is that i have seen many ACCA qualified students failing in this paper.
Additionally u r no one to challenge the paper setting and paper checking standards of our prestigious institute.
Regarding Auditing paper it is now turned into an open book exam. I hope u will get satisfied with tht.
Plus u dont consider the choice given by ACCA.
Plus another matter of fact. ACCA doesnt make u work hard. I have seen so many students failing in CA after completing ACCA during past 3 years. And ICAP requires alot more effort to be put into.
If u r an ACCA i respect ur feelings, but i wud ask u to try any of the papers u mentioned of CA.
- Muhammad Amir - 04-27-2008
Dear Sir Abdur Rehman,
I have mentioned so many times in this forum that passing CA exams is a different thing whereas CA curriculum is something different.
The above mentioned ground realities are the exact ground relities for which ACCA students feel that ICAP is playing some monopoly game against them.
As far as hard working is concerned i accept ACCA students are proved to be less hard working as compared to ICAP students and the sole reason behind this is the passing criteria(not paper setting standard) let i give you one example here, one of my relative is having 4-5 attempts in Economics and can you believe that Sir Farooq Subhani(Eco. Teacher at ALhamd and a Gold Medalist of KU and writer of Eco. books) says that he is most intelligent students i have ever seen and can you also believe that sir Farooq Subhani refer his weaker students to him.
Conclusion is that Hard working is an obvious element in CA.
Regards,
Muhammad Amir
- Abdur.Rehman - 04-28-2008
So being an ACCA student, wt do u want from ICAP???
If u want more exemptions, let me quote u a personal example.
After my Module D i applied for exemptions of ACCA and i got exemption upto 2.1
I took Pakistan stream. So i had covered all the syllabus of tax and corporate laws of 2.2 and 2.3 in my earlier CA studies. I sent the print outs of both CA and ACCA courses for these two papers to ACCA admin, and wrote a note after that in similar fashion as u did in this thread and three others.
and ACCA replied in good fashion, which i liked.
They simply said, that ever institute has its own paper setting and paper checking standards and the exemptions are not merely based on syllabus covered. So i got satisfied and passed those paper with three days of preparation and solving 5 previous papers.
wut do u say on it...
- Muhammad Amir - 04-28-2008
Dear Sir Abdur Rehman,
I am not concerned with ICAP Exemptions and In my opinion CA After ACCA is just like Metric After Inter.
I am concerned in only one thing and that is Political Games of ICAP and Sleepy Role Of Local Manegement Of ACCA, I just say that why ACCA-Affiliates are obliged to Complete CA Module 'E' and 'F' if they want to start their future in Audit Profession and why can't they start public practice on the basis of their ACCA(Audit Plus Tax as in UK).
I hope you can understand this
Regards,
Muhammad Amir
- Abdur.Rehman - 04-28-2008
Well i can give u a couple of reasons why not
1) ACCA doesnt require the same level of articleship tht CA requires. Even in UK u need to complete articles with an ICAEW registered firm to do ICAEW after ACCA. Although i guess all papers of ICAEW are exempt after ACCA.
2) In the biginning, say 4-5 years back ACCA in its pursuit of globalization, passed too many students just for nothing. Now there marking criteria is quite strict after making i guess more than 3,4 lac students worldwide. This is bull ****. This is hieght of non professionalism. I have personally seen ACCAs who know not more thn an MBA finance. When u go to different clients on audits, only then u can know wts the reality out there in the market. CA inter with articles are far more paid and regarded in industry as compared to a simple ACCA.
3) It is imparative to the harmonization of standards and principles of auditing and accounting in a country to keep the profession in the hands of one body.
4) As per ICAP and as per my experience also, despite the good syllabus and very good exam questios of ACCA papers, somehow, the ACCA students fail to deliver not only in ICAP exam but also in the industry, which shows there is something lacking.
U wrote CA after ACCA=Matric after inter. I can just call it ur inferiority complex. I tell u wt im with ACCA if they make the articleship compulsory from an audit firm, eliminate choice from their papers and leave the globalization objective and pass students on merit(which they have now done to some extent). I myself prepared my financial reporting paper from questions of 3.6 and now doing 3.7 questions for my business finance decisions paper. But only setting good questions in exams is not enough to deliver in our profession. Its not the degree tht counts, its the professionalism and the ability to do things in reality(not only in exams) tht counts, which can only come with 3-4 years of articleship.
Anyways stick to ur point and keep calling ICAP bad. Thts maximum u can do. and stop calling me sir Abdur.Rehman.
- Muhammad Amir - 04-28-2008
Dear,
I can only say that your self made theories has no importance for ACCA.
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Tahoma, Arial" id="quote">quote<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">But only setting good questions in exams is not enough to deliver in our profession.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></font id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
If ACCA's paper standard is good then how huge number of Inefficient students able to pass their exams, this is your self created theory otherwise the reality is very different, If you believe me that what i am saying is right then believe me whenever after my exam i come to home and calculate the aggregate marks, At the result day my actual marks reflect nearly same number as was caculated just after paper.
Regards,
Muhammad Amir
- Shahbaz - 04-28-2008
Assalamoalaikum Muhammad Amir,
Brother, kia aap ko paisay miltay hein ye sab likhnay k ya aap be inteha faarigh hein? P
Regards,
Syed Muhammad Shahbaz
- kamranACA - 04-28-2008
Dear Abdur.Rehman,
It's nice to see you on the forum after such a long time. Do participate and contribute regularly.
As far as ACCA in Pakistan is concerned, it represents in majority the failure class which cannot qualify CA or which is afraid of ICAP policies. I know, those ACCAs who are doing ACCA with CA or who are doing ACCA as an idea of following a best choice are not included in this category. These are however very rare in whole ACCA students population.
Some one from ACCA accepted in a thread at this forum that calling into question the passing criteria or result outcome of ICAP is the most weird and non-sense act on behalf of a student. It is in fact a grapes are sour situation. I myself being a student of ICAP never witnessed any injustice by ICAP in declaring results. At the same time we see that a majority of those ACCAs who opt to do CA get bad failures and manys who don't even do it due to fear of failure call into question the ICAP policies.
Further to it even after discussing ICAP policies they also agree that their Pakistan Chapter is doing nothing. I wonder why they don't much foucss on their issues instead of discusisng ICAP. This shows how much influenced they are. They should work hard to improve theirselves and their chapter and when at a point of time (which I don't foresee in next 50 years) they reach to a stable position then they should look forward to compete CAs.
All other debate and discussion will bring no results for them. And if CA is matric after intermediate (the most bizzare thought), then why they are worried at all? Do try to make a position.
Let's see what genie they will get out of the bottle in next 50 years in Pakistan.
Regards,
KAMRAN.
- Astute Accountant - 04-28-2008
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Tahoma, Arial" id="quote">quote<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Shahbaz</i>
<br />Assalamoalaikum Muhammad Amir,
Brother, kia aap ko paisay miltay hein ye sab likhnay k ya aap be inteha faarigh hein? P
Regards,
Syed Muhammad Shahbaz
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></font id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Hahaha..... ACCA doesn't have so much spare money to throw away. The second reason hmmmmm .... P
- idreesdurrani - 04-28-2008
Even though I personally ignore such kind of useless debates, but I want to make some clarifications to Mr. Amir.
At one side you agree that CA (ICAP)students are more hard working than ACCA, yet you are not willing to put a premium on their hard work by saying doing CA after ACCA is just like a Matriculation after Inter. For you, the extra effort does not mean anything. Mate the difference is highlighted once you come to practice .
CA reigns supreme not only in Pakistan but also in UK itself, the breeding ground for ACCAs. Just check how much of FTSE 100 companies Finance Directors are ACCA's ...very few...the wide majority are ACAs from ICAEW. How many of the ACCA affiliates are hired by Big Four? They still prefer CAs' over ACCAs. Can you tell us why despite the fact that you can find thousands of ACCA's in UK, the big Four (EY London) is hiring Pakistani CA's.
Please note , this is not to undermine the ACCA's or any person in particular, the sole purpose is just to remove some misconceptions about CA.
Regards,
- Muhammad Amir - 04-30-2008
Dear Idrees,
Let me clear one thing,
The purpose of curriculum comparion was not to appeal more exemptions from ICAP. A very simple reason and as said by me earlier that the only reason for making questions on ICAP is their political game and prejudiced policies against ACCAs that can't be denied by any sensible person.
If ACCA students are learning the same contents and in some case much better than ICAP then why they are not allowed same and eqitable treatment, why audit firms are now a days become an hurdle for ACCA students, why they(Audit Firms) are inducting 7 to 8 attempts CA-Inter and rejecting first time passed finalist of ACCA(just one or two lapses in papers and you know that their is no referral system in ACCA), why ACCAs are being cosidered as second tier qualifieds.
I must say and you have to agree that there are political players who are doing something against ACCA and there are some clear evidences of it but i think disclosure of names at this public forum will not be an ethical thing.
Regards,
Muhammad Amir
- fishaikh - 04-30-2008
Dear Amir,
Let me clarify one thing bro... nowadays even CA inters are facing alot of competition in getting into big 4... i mean its my personal experience... i belonged to the latest mfc-batch, but still i didnt even get interview call from the big 3 firms last time.. So its nomore a situation where ppl passing CA inter in 7-8 attempts easily get inducted in big4..