04-14-2007, 11:42 PM
Dear Amir,
I agree with your observation about lack of research and efforts by us. The intent of making money overnight has developed with the passage of time and its main reason is unemployment of so many people. You must have seen so many families where one person would be earning and all other would be the dependents. Our 52% population is of females which does not contribute towards social development. I am talking about the majority. We need a change of thoughts and culture of dependence over others. Every one should contribute his portion and it will lead to increased GDP, per capita income and prosperity.
I always say that advice is to be relied upon after using own mind and perception. Further, if some one is totally unaware of any thing, he/she should take advice from more than one person. One should ultimately use his/her mind and have a courage to accept the results of the decision taken by him/her. If your friend at big4 gave u such an advice, it might be his perception. You have to use your mind and decide what suits your circumstances. It's not a matter of fight at all.
You said that
"....i mean if ACA is that better then ACCA so why ICAP's market is diminishing day by day.....why ACCA has got more exposure in potiential employers, companies(Specially investment)..."
Since I am not placed at UK or GULF, I dont argue too much about the conditions prevailing there. However, if you are talking about Pakistan, I cannot comment on this though except for leaving a smile for you.
You interalia your discussion about personal development, said that
"lets think if I being an ACCA(Member) go to an employer who has a package of 100,000 for this vacancy plus a CULTUS.....And i speak their core urdu....and when he asked me that what is this ACCA...i tell him that It is world's fastest and largest growing accountancy body situated in UK"
You know CAs dont need to explain that "Sir this CA, it is done from bala bala institute and has its bala bala worth in bala bala country." Becoz people know what the CAs are upto. They know its worth. They ask only specific questions about experience and previous jobs and salary packages. Rest assure. If feel doubts, plz consult others. I dont argue any further about it.
I did not call number cruncher to ACCAs. People normally say that accountants are number crunchers. Since CA and ACCA both are accountants it falls on both qualification. However, I think a professional can do so much for any business and I have seen the cases where CAs with their efforts made the sick units the most viable. They are off course among the best managers.
In my view ACCAs have good curriculum contents. I dont negate it but they cannot engage in public practices unless they get full training for it. Therefore, personally I would always be against permitting them for public practice. If some body does not know what is difference between weaved and knitted fabric, how fabric meters are converted into yarn kgs to arrive at its costs, what processes are involved, how dyeing or printing is done, what cost ingredients are required and how much are required, what are its standards and what are actual results, how capacities of such complex machnies are arrived at and how inventories are valued, then how he can audit such an organization. It's quite a different exposure than simply reading the IFAC's pronouncements. When you are auditors, in so many matters, you have to develope your knowledge which comes only with training and exposure. You cannot go for experts' advices for each and every transaction. I know those CAs whose presence faints the color of faces of engineers and production people while results are discussed. This is the grace of CA. I am not talking about textile merely, this was simply an example. It has to happen in all sectors either it is steel, textile, petroleum, sugar, leather, sports, food, bankers or other sectors.
Where one does not know what are part one and part two financings, what does these mean and how these are documented and when one does not know what is pre-shipment and what is post shipment financing, what is suppliers credit, how it is got approved, how TFCs are issued and placed on stock exchanges, how additional resources of financings are arranged when collaterals are very meager, whats the major difference behind different finance arrangement, at what stages these could be obtained and where these could be utilized and what penalties could be expected on which sort of actions and breaches and how such penlaties could be avoided, how export invoices are negotiated, how foreign currency loans are obtained and how these are adjusted against export realizations through state bank, how will he audit such transactions. Yes, off course one has to learn each and every thing practically. You said you people are good at financial side. When you prepare financial models, you might choose good discounting rates by applying various theories to the ecocnomic factors. But for arriving at the true cash flows that would result in best estimation/valuation, you will again need much more indepth knowledge of the subject business, its operations, its markets, and other technical issues surrounding the determination of cash flows and their timings along with the terminal value estimations. It would never be that simple as MM theory appears to be in bookish studies. One has to learn this art practicaly. Off course studies support the professional works but so much needs to be obtained from undergoing trainings. This all is the real world where no body talks without money. The invetsment appraisal, capital market, portfolio and other theories studied from books only make a base to step forward. One needs to get out of the day dreams. In Pakistan, you ACCAs have to learn this all from CAs. Have you any doubt over it. Then why dont you accept CAs better than you at least in Pakistan. Dont talk to me about UK or else.
In fact CAs always remain ACCAs' USTAADs (teachers) and as per the Qaul of Hazrat Ali Karamallah Wajho, ACCAs should always keep regard for them. (Just Kidding dont mind).
At the end you talked about some LOOT MAAR and GIRI HUI SOCH for which I dont have any comments. We all should start correcting from our ownselves and from our homes. This way one day Inshallah we will succeed improving our country.
You expressed your dream to one day prove the worth of ACCA in Pakistan. It's very good and my prayers are with you.
May God fullfil all your noble dreams.
Best regards,
Kamran.
I agree with your observation about lack of research and efforts by us. The intent of making money overnight has developed with the passage of time and its main reason is unemployment of so many people. You must have seen so many families where one person would be earning and all other would be the dependents. Our 52% population is of females which does not contribute towards social development. I am talking about the majority. We need a change of thoughts and culture of dependence over others. Every one should contribute his portion and it will lead to increased GDP, per capita income and prosperity.
I always say that advice is to be relied upon after using own mind and perception. Further, if some one is totally unaware of any thing, he/she should take advice from more than one person. One should ultimately use his/her mind and have a courage to accept the results of the decision taken by him/her. If your friend at big4 gave u such an advice, it might be his perception. You have to use your mind and decide what suits your circumstances. It's not a matter of fight at all.
You said that
"....i mean if ACA is that better then ACCA so why ICAP's market is diminishing day by day.....why ACCA has got more exposure in potiential employers, companies(Specially investment)..."
Since I am not placed at UK or GULF, I dont argue too much about the conditions prevailing there. However, if you are talking about Pakistan, I cannot comment on this though except for leaving a smile for you.
You interalia your discussion about personal development, said that
"lets think if I being an ACCA(Member) go to an employer who has a package of 100,000 for this vacancy plus a CULTUS.....And i speak their core urdu....and when he asked me that what is this ACCA...i tell him that It is world's fastest and largest growing accountancy body situated in UK"
You know CAs dont need to explain that "Sir this CA, it is done from bala bala institute and has its bala bala worth in bala bala country." Becoz people know what the CAs are upto. They know its worth. They ask only specific questions about experience and previous jobs and salary packages. Rest assure. If feel doubts, plz consult others. I dont argue any further about it.
I did not call number cruncher to ACCAs. People normally say that accountants are number crunchers. Since CA and ACCA both are accountants it falls on both qualification. However, I think a professional can do so much for any business and I have seen the cases where CAs with their efforts made the sick units the most viable. They are off course among the best managers.
In my view ACCAs have good curriculum contents. I dont negate it but they cannot engage in public practices unless they get full training for it. Therefore, personally I would always be against permitting them for public practice. If some body does not know what is difference between weaved and knitted fabric, how fabric meters are converted into yarn kgs to arrive at its costs, what processes are involved, how dyeing or printing is done, what cost ingredients are required and how much are required, what are its standards and what are actual results, how capacities of such complex machnies are arrived at and how inventories are valued, then how he can audit such an organization. It's quite a different exposure than simply reading the IFAC's pronouncements. When you are auditors, in so many matters, you have to develope your knowledge which comes only with training and exposure. You cannot go for experts' advices for each and every transaction. I know those CAs whose presence faints the color of faces of engineers and production people while results are discussed. This is the grace of CA. I am not talking about textile merely, this was simply an example. It has to happen in all sectors either it is steel, textile, petroleum, sugar, leather, sports, food, bankers or other sectors.
Where one does not know what are part one and part two financings, what does these mean and how these are documented and when one does not know what is pre-shipment and what is post shipment financing, what is suppliers credit, how it is got approved, how TFCs are issued and placed on stock exchanges, how additional resources of financings are arranged when collaterals are very meager, whats the major difference behind different finance arrangement, at what stages these could be obtained and where these could be utilized and what penalties could be expected on which sort of actions and breaches and how such penlaties could be avoided, how export invoices are negotiated, how foreign currency loans are obtained and how these are adjusted against export realizations through state bank, how will he audit such transactions. Yes, off course one has to learn each and every thing practically. You said you people are good at financial side. When you prepare financial models, you might choose good discounting rates by applying various theories to the ecocnomic factors. But for arriving at the true cash flows that would result in best estimation/valuation, you will again need much more indepth knowledge of the subject business, its operations, its markets, and other technical issues surrounding the determination of cash flows and their timings along with the terminal value estimations. It would never be that simple as MM theory appears to be in bookish studies. One has to learn this art practicaly. Off course studies support the professional works but so much needs to be obtained from undergoing trainings. This all is the real world where no body talks without money. The invetsment appraisal, capital market, portfolio and other theories studied from books only make a base to step forward. One needs to get out of the day dreams. In Pakistan, you ACCAs have to learn this all from CAs. Have you any doubt over it. Then why dont you accept CAs better than you at least in Pakistan. Dont talk to me about UK or else.
In fact CAs always remain ACCAs' USTAADs (teachers) and as per the Qaul of Hazrat Ali Karamallah Wajho, ACCAs should always keep regard for them. (Just Kidding dont mind).
At the end you talked about some LOOT MAAR and GIRI HUI SOCH for which I dont have any comments. We all should start correcting from our ownselves and from our homes. This way one day Inshallah we will succeed improving our country.
You expressed your dream to one day prove the worth of ACCA in Pakistan. It's very good and my prayers are with you.
May God fullfil all your noble dreams.
Best regards,
Kamran.
