12-25-2008, 10:43 PM
Thanks Pracs for your post. I will reply to unseendemon in detail later.
Pracs now u can see why I say that ICAP and its members take decisions without collecting relevant information and without forecasting future impact of their decision. It is shown in MOU between ICAEW and ICAP. ICAP did the same thing in ACCA case when it gave number of exemptions to ACCA and after finding that it was not right decision ICAP took exemptions back in 2000.
ICAP is going to do the same thing in ICAEW case. I am 100% sure that after sometimes (say a year, i think more earlier) ICAEW will allow Pakistani university graduate (since now graduation is 4 yrs in Pakistan) to register with ICAEW and start training with firms that ICAEW authorized in Pakistan. When this will happen (I think this route is available now for Pakistani 4 yrs graduates and 2 yrs bachelors with 2 yrs Master) ICAP will be out of Pakistani market.
I do have sympathy for ICAP but can you see ICAP and its members behavior towards ACCA Affiliate and students is Pakistan ( I care more about ACCA students in Pakistan)
Infact this MOU between ICAEW and ICAP is beneficial for ACCA students in Pakistan, in long run you will agree with me. Let ICAP and its member suffer.
One more thing, you need to explain ICAP and its members difference between ICAEW MOU with ICAI and ICAP, otherwise they will not understand.
You can see when qualified ICAP members like Kamran say that this MOU between ICAEW and ICAP is fine then you can see the quality of ICAP and caliber of its members. I am not criticizing anyone I am just talking about ICAP and its members ability to foresee things in advance.
Now if I say that ICAI (india) is capable of foreseeing things in advance and ICAP is not, then will I be wrong?. Remember there is not a single ICAEW authorised firm in India as it is against Indian Law and there is also supreme court of India ruling. ICAI did same thing with ACCA in India. One more thing Indian CA with 2 yrs post membership experience has to pass only 1 paper of ICAEW and Indian CA with less than 2 yrs post membership experience need to pass ICAEW 3 papers. Where in ICAP case all ICAP members have to pass ICAEW 3 papers and some need to pass ICAEW 4 papers regardless of their post membership experience (even they have more than 2 year post membbership experience) plus ICAP members have to undergo 2 yrs training under the supervision of ICAEW members
Pracs ICAP and its members will not understand what we are saying. I even emailed ICAP explaining ICAEW futures plans in details but ICAP never replied me. ICAP and its members just say that they are best and do not listen to anyone.
In that case why not let ICAP and its members suffer as a result of this MOU. Remember this MOU between ICAP and ICAEW is beneficial for ACCA Pakistan in long run. Let ICAP and its member have illusion that they are the best. Just wait and see. I am serious ICAP is killing itself.
If I say something about ACCA and ICAP then ppl will say i think ICAP is better than ACCA, so i think its better not to say anything and see if ICAP members are rational to find out other ways.
Last thing, Pracs ICAP and its members are not going to accept this reality when you say that ICAEW loosing numbers game to ACCA. In post number 17 on this page hounorable ICAP member Kamran said, his words are
<font color="red">"Yess, ACCA members tend to become ICEAW members for the reason that they know ICEAW had been a better institute. If this is not the case, why they wish to do this at all. I donât know why some ACCAs feel they are going to takeover everything in this world. Previously a statement was given that ACCA was going to take up ICAP market. Now the above post wishes to pin point that similar things are going to happen with ICEAW. Mashallah"</font id="red">
When ICAP and its members have this thinking then can one expect any rational decision from them.
I again say ACCA is taking over ICAEW and ACCA will take over ICAEW. If someone does not want to accept this reality then its upto person.
Khalid, ACCA
Pracs now u can see why I say that ICAP and its members take decisions without collecting relevant information and without forecasting future impact of their decision. It is shown in MOU between ICAEW and ICAP. ICAP did the same thing in ACCA case when it gave number of exemptions to ACCA and after finding that it was not right decision ICAP took exemptions back in 2000.
ICAP is going to do the same thing in ICAEW case. I am 100% sure that after sometimes (say a year, i think more earlier) ICAEW will allow Pakistani university graduate (since now graduation is 4 yrs in Pakistan) to register with ICAEW and start training with firms that ICAEW authorized in Pakistan. When this will happen (I think this route is available now for Pakistani 4 yrs graduates and 2 yrs bachelors with 2 yrs Master) ICAP will be out of Pakistani market.
I do have sympathy for ICAP but can you see ICAP and its members behavior towards ACCA Affiliate and students is Pakistan ( I care more about ACCA students in Pakistan)
Infact this MOU between ICAEW and ICAP is beneficial for ACCA students in Pakistan, in long run you will agree with me. Let ICAP and its member suffer.
One more thing, you need to explain ICAP and its members difference between ICAEW MOU with ICAI and ICAP, otherwise they will not understand.
You can see when qualified ICAP members like Kamran say that this MOU between ICAEW and ICAP is fine then you can see the quality of ICAP and caliber of its members. I am not criticizing anyone I am just talking about ICAP and its members ability to foresee things in advance.
Now if I say that ICAI (india) is capable of foreseeing things in advance and ICAP is not, then will I be wrong?. Remember there is not a single ICAEW authorised firm in India as it is against Indian Law and there is also supreme court of India ruling. ICAI did same thing with ACCA in India. One more thing Indian CA with 2 yrs post membership experience has to pass only 1 paper of ICAEW and Indian CA with less than 2 yrs post membership experience need to pass ICAEW 3 papers. Where in ICAP case all ICAP members have to pass ICAEW 3 papers and some need to pass ICAEW 4 papers regardless of their post membership experience (even they have more than 2 year post membbership experience) plus ICAP members have to undergo 2 yrs training under the supervision of ICAEW members
Pracs ICAP and its members will not understand what we are saying. I even emailed ICAP explaining ICAEW futures plans in details but ICAP never replied me. ICAP and its members just say that they are best and do not listen to anyone.
In that case why not let ICAP and its members suffer as a result of this MOU. Remember this MOU between ICAP and ICAEW is beneficial for ACCA Pakistan in long run. Let ICAP and its member have illusion that they are the best. Just wait and see. I am serious ICAP is killing itself.
If I say something about ACCA and ICAP then ppl will say i think ICAP is better than ACCA, so i think its better not to say anything and see if ICAP members are rational to find out other ways.
Last thing, Pracs ICAP and its members are not going to accept this reality when you say that ICAEW loosing numbers game to ACCA. In post number 17 on this page hounorable ICAP member Kamran said, his words are
<font color="red">"Yess, ACCA members tend to become ICEAW members for the reason that they know ICEAW had been a better institute. If this is not the case, why they wish to do this at all. I donât know why some ACCAs feel they are going to takeover everything in this world. Previously a statement was given that ACCA was going to take up ICAP market. Now the above post wishes to pin point that similar things are going to happen with ICEAW. Mashallah"</font id="red">
When ICAP and its members have this thinking then can one expect any rational decision from them.
I again say ACCA is taking over ICAEW and ACCA will take over ICAEW. If someone does not want to accept this reality then its upto person.
Khalid, ACCA
