ARE YOU IN LOVE WITH SOMEONE?

Imran · 07-23-2007, 06:24 PM

Miss Cool lioness
Your story is very painfull. Any way from these things one can learn much. But make sure that its our belief that her kam may Allah ke behtari hoti hey. Wish you good luck
Regards
Imran

kamranACA · 07-23-2007, 06:57 PM

Dear Miss Coollioness and Mr. Imran,

I was out of touch due to my two days week-end consumed by looking at the Sawan's amazing rain and immaturely playing with my guitar creating unknown tunes by the natural movement of my fingers in consonance with what the ears wanted to hear. Cigar also helped to kill the time. Hope you and all others would be fine and doing their best. By the way Sawan's rains are so beautiful and I love these two months i.e. Sawan and Bhaadon (sub-continental months).

Mr. Imran, I have full respect for your ideas and am not personally affected by any one's opinion. Truly speaking, I wish not any body to change his ideas due to me. It's just a discussion forum and sharing of ideas appears like having a cup of tea with friends in the corner of college's canteen. Though those days have gone, still I am attracted of thinking about my college days, where I always participated the chats and debates. I also won prizes for doing so, but losing the debate remained common feature of our discussions and never dishearted us.

Dear Coolioness,

I was already not feeling good at initiating the lal masjid issue on this thread and had already conveyed my sorry for it. Your analysis and conclusion on lal majsid issue is substantially agreeable for me except for the last two and half lines of the concerned paragraph where you declared / compared the terrorism of rigids with the "Khuda kee Lathi" and said that

"now its Govt's turn to compensate and pay the price for all the killings she has been doing througout the country. So just wait and see as you must have heard and read in books that "Khuda kee laathi be-awaaz hothi hai.""

Killings of very one without a reason is condemnable. Terrorism either done by government or rigids is condemnable. If the Bush affected non islamized government has done wrong in some wrong way then what would be the impact of same act from the so-called religious "fully respected" and "fully knowledged" persons. It is ridiculous if we support them to kill innocents who dont even have any direct linkage with lal masjid issue and who were by no means the decision makers. I also feel it to be an endeavor from such rigids to call USA to attack on Pakistan (may God abstain them). Such intentions have even been shown by Bush and who would be resposnible for such an incident, if it happens. The JAAHIL government or AALIM suicidal attackers? (Now dont say that these attackers are not from these so-called religious people). I dont take any decision, every one has to make his own opinion. Let me to close this topic on this thread.

Dear Coollioness,

I never felt any proud of any praise done by any brother or sister on this forum or anywhere else. I know I am the most humble creature of God. I have no doubt over it. In my perception I dont make the things complex. Still, if you feel it had been a complex way to present the issues, you can get more clarification from me on anything you dont digest. You may also comment on the pros and cons of complexity attributed to my discussion and I would like to ammend the presentation wherever would be practicable. Thanks for pointing out.

Dear Coollioness,

You highlighted the framework of human psychology by defining his/her social life cycle which enforces him/her to remain encapsulated within his own standard which develops unconciusly. In my view point the standard of one's life changes from time to time with the changes in his/her status and surrounding culture in a given society. So many among us are the persons who have developed and improved their status with the passage of time passing through various stages. Some also face a big change of standards, status, and culture over a very short period. This can happen and you can find so many examples for it. Mr. Qudrutllah Shahab was the most famous beaurocrate in Pakistani history. His childhood never matched his rest of (grown up) life style and status. There are millions of such examples. Look at celebrities, players, scientists and many more who are the best examples. Look at Ibraham Lincon and other such examples. These are not the rare cases.

Further, this is not compulsory that some Jhuggi (even middle class) resident has to move to some palace if he improves his status by means of hard work. Even the world has witnessed so many cases where this proved to be exactly a reverse situation for some people. Destruction of mughal regime is a big example where people went to lock ups from the luxorious lives of palaces. There are again uncountable examples. There was a time when my father died, I had only Rupees 15,000 in my pocket and the whole of life was ahead. I did not even knew what was the investment of my father and wherefrom I will have to meet the both ends. I was a student of CA who was not even part one qualified at that time. People were looking at us with the views that we would be destroyed. Now, after the passage of ten years, I have three Cars in my house with almost all luxuries of life and having a very attractive earning at the age of 31, which does not make me to proceed for UAE or UK.

Therefore, in my view, the standards have to change from time to time. Human life requires greatest extent of flexibility. As per my conclusion there is no fix standard for any one in his life span.

Due to this, I still stand on my idea that the thing which does not make our mind to love the ugly faces or out of our class (at a given point of time) badly represented, illiterate person has the physical attributes. It could be spontaneous like so many things are in our life but it cannot be called something having attributes of soul and not of body.

I also clarify that from physical attributes, I dont solely mean sexual attractions. There are always so many other considerations. However, as I said earlier, beauty is the biggest attraction.

I still make a difference between simple wild feelings and the real love attractions. Of course there is the biggest difference among these two situations and feelings. As far as involvement of arabic ladies with Pakistani or other drivers is concerened, it is most probably the wild feeling which is the basic instinct of humans and in my view it has nothing to do with LOVE.

I once again feel sorry for the incident happened to you due to some person of my gender and dont appreciate any one to decieve the others.

Regards,

Kamran.

BeL@L · 07-23-2007, 07:39 PM

<blockquote id="quote">quote<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Cool Lioness
 <blockquote id="quote">quote<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by BeL@L
 yeah, you 'r right i can't stop myself. but i believe if i try my best to keep things clear it will be good for both sides. And marriage is good thing rather then keep in relation.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

hmmmm aik waqat tha jab mein bhi aisa hi kaha karthi thi.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
jo hota ha sahi hota ha..us mein ALLAH ki koi na koi behtari hoti ha aur i strong belief ap ki life mein aghey jo kuch ho ga woh sab aitna acha ho ga you will forget all...INSHALLAH...aur apne liye bhi yahi kahono ga kuch bhi ho ALLAH mujhe us per razi rehne ki tofeeq de..her lamheye per us ki raza samahj ker guzer jane ki tofeeq de..AMEEN

Imran · 07-23-2007, 09:34 PM

Dear kamran

Thanks for nice complements. As per as your human psychology is concerned i swear sari sar k oper say guzar gaye. And i am happy to hear about your achievements and struggle. And you are very much right dat love is totally different from wild feelings.

Mr Belal

I agree with your point of view

kamranACA · 07-23-2007, 11:45 PM

Dear Imran,

I did not present any human psychology. Rather, I only commented on, the human psychology / unconcious development of standards, narrated by Miss Coollioness.

In my view there is no predetermined standard which might enforce any one to remain within certain sphere. As per my idea, standards always remain subject to the changes during various phases of life.

Thanks for your message.

Regards,

Kamran.

Imran · 07-24-2007, 02:22 PM

But there are certain exeption to this standard. Have not you heard that love is blind. Then what is meant by this.

Cool Lioness · 07-24-2007, 04:58 PM

Mohtaram Kamran Sahib,

Your analysis and conclusion on lal majsid issue is substantially agreeable for me except for the last two and half lines of the concerned paragraph where you declared / compared the terrorism of rigids with the "Khuda kee Lathi" Well if you are agreed to the first portion of these lines where i said Govt has made a bigger mistake then it means that Govt should be punished too on her wrong act or making an extreme decision. I am sure she is not afraid of public Lathee so i used Khuda kee laathi.

It is ridiculous if we support them to kill innocents who dont even have any direct linkage with lal masjid issue and who were by no means the decision makers. Well no one is supporting the killing of innocents. But if you ask the same question from those people who are doing these suicide attacks, they can also say the same that govt has been killing their innocents. For instance i can quote the incidence of bombardment on a Deeni Madrisa in Baajor, then an attack on a Madrissa in Wazeeristan area Data Khel, how many students got killed in those attacks from the security forces of Govt for unknown reasons. I am not saying that these Deeni people should start killing security forces since as you said that these forces are obeying someone's orders. But i dont know how Govt is gonna justify her killings? Anyway the root cause of all this mess is the division of Pakistan into two groups, Inteha Passand and Roshan Khiyaal. What is this none sense propaganda? We never heard about it before. Yeh khoun kharaba tou ab chalay ga. This is what we all are worried for. Parties on both sides are lacking Ahsaas e Jurm.

Such intentions have even been shown by Bush (I heard too in News that USA has already warned Pakistan that he can take military action on some areas of Pakistan.) and who would be responsible for such an incident, if it happens. âDo you have the right answer? Can you declare one responsible?â 

I never felt any proud of any praise done by any brother or sister on this forum or anywhere else. I know I am the most humble creature of God ( So you are proud to be the MOST humble creature. [)] ). I have no doubt over it ( See you are proud). In my perception I dont make the things complex. No you do not make them complex. I did not mean it. I mean you say it in so complex way that first of all at least I donât understand what you said. So I read the line againâ¦â¦ and again [)]. anyway i am getting used to your style so no worries

Look at Ibraham Lincon and other such examples. These are not the rare cases. NO NO NO you got it completely wrong. Standard of life doesnât have to do anything with wealth. Wealth is something that may not stay with you for your whole life. Neither will it stay away from you. May be i should have said like your family background, your style of living set a Criteria of life for you. You set criteria for your love too. Its just an unconscious built up inside you. Like I quoted a simple example of a labor. Looking at a Labor will hardly make my heart beat for him. Because I know I cannot marry a Labor. He is not my choice at all. Itâs my own unconscious decision. AS far as falling in love is concerned, you do not fall for a person who on the very first sight do not come fit on your criteria basic points. I cannot deny the fact that the physical beauty can be the first step to your love. But if you find the same person, only beautiful outside and not inside, or he/she is completely off from your criteria basic requirements, you would not even know how quick you will get fed up of him/her. So physical beauty is insignificant if compared to your naturally set criteria. And I must say that this criteria hardly changes in your life. There can be small changes in it but usually it remains same throughout your life. Its just like old habit that die hard.

Rest I am really sorry for your father. May God give him peace in that world too. He would be definitely blessed coz I can see his son.

As far as your these words are concerned âwhich does not make me to proceed for UAE or UK.â I would say that everyone has his circumstances. If you had to face a tough time in your life in young age, may be other has gone thru more severe circumstances. As far as proceeding to foreign country is concerned I think itâs just like Jahan aap ka daana paani likha ho, aap ko wahan jaana hi parta hai and Allah makes ways for you. Travel for Rizaq is your fate and of course not sin. Because its something predefined by the creator.

Regards

kamranACA · 07-24-2007, 04:58 PM

Dear Imran,

There could be so much difference between what we have heard and what the actual postion is.

If you deem that love is blind then you must realize that so much in a human's life is done blindly. We only need to concentrate. Only LOVE is not an exception.

We are blind when we take all the wrong decisions of life. Humans are murdered as a result of blind reactions, fullfiling the wild wishes and feelings is a blind act, following the undue requirements of wives and forgetting the rights of parents is a blind act, losing one's monies at casinos is blind act. There could be thousands of examples.

Its the habit of a human that where he loses, (or is expected to lose) he calls such an act as a blind act. Further, the peaks on both ends fetch similar conclusions. Getting the immense (almost unbearable) happiness and facing the immence grief, both have similar consequences. In so many cases, one can see the results. Since the real LOVE, if achieved brings the immense happiness and feeling of greatest success and, if lost brings the immense grief, its consequences almost remain the same.

You may not agree with my mentality, but I wrote what I considered correct.

Best regards,

Kamran.

kamranACA · 07-24-2007, 06:03 PM

Dear Coollioness,

Some parts of ur message again made me to feel that I write in somewhat complex manner and you oftenly dont understand my words.

I dont feel it odd to proceed to foreign countries for earning. Even we can earn from european or non-muslim countries. However, I dont appreciate to have a permanent residence in such countries just with the intent of having a better life. This oftenly needs to sacrifice so much. However, UAE or gulf countries are not the bad options being at least the muslim countries. My words were not meant for hiting you. Infact I had been endeavoring to set up my own public practice as a chartered accountant at Dubai, but due to certain limitations I rejected this decision of mine. Then, some one year back I got a very attractive offer from one of the Dubai's banks through friend but God blessed me (exactly in those days) a good position at Pakistan which did not allow me to leave for an insignificant difference. Now again, I got an offer some ten or tweleve days before which was by no means a bad one. But again by the blessing of Allah my position improved in a very short run (unexpectedly) and the difference did not appear to be enormous. Allah blesses his creatures every where and it has no credit for our hard work or effort. Not at all. (This is not a proud by the way).

However, since I dont mind to earn from foreign countries/economies, I can any time opt this option and am by no means against such earning.

Thaks for your concern and wishes for my father. May God bless you too.

You said that standard has nothing to do with wealth. In my view it definitely has to do a lot with wealth, earning levels, residential status, life's luxuries, family's background (to some extent) and so much other linked with these measures of STANDARD. If the son of a labor will turn out to be the minister or some other renowned man, he will hardly opt to find his love in KACHI ABADI where his father was used to live. He would definitely try to find his love among the high ups e.g. politicians, army generals, industrialists, and beaurocrates etc. Just check out the development of relationships among the cream (the wealthy people) of our society. The changed position changes the thinking style and enlarges the view of ground in front of eyes.

Likewise, when people are destroyed, they have to curtail the view that was previously infront of their eyes and this brings a lot of changes in perceptions, expectations and feelings.

If it is hard for you to understand, or if in ur viewpoint, I am talking without any basis then we should terminate our discussion on this topic as it will lead to nil conclusion. Otherwise, I think the issue is crystal clear and nothing could be harvested from beating about the bushes.

I dont much appreciate the attacks on DEENI MADRISSAs of northern areas specially by USA, but at the same time I dont appreciate at all some of the acts of these MADRISSA people (as heard on meadia. in my view every one cannot lie) e.g. keepings militants and wanted people as guests, keeping amunition in mosques, training students for suicidal attacks and war without the consent of government (that is totally not their responsibility), pentrating Afghanistan without any legal excuse for promoting terrorism (as alleged by Hamid Karzai), attacking on civilians and innocent security people with any reason etc etc.

However, as far as allegations from government are concerned over the activities of these MADRISSAs, these have been proved to a great extent after looking at the recent suicidal attacks from the militants/terrorists of these areas. They were trained on same lines and they have all the alleged ammunition. All Muftiaan-e-Karam of Pakistan and IMAM-e-KABA have given their opinion against such activties of these MADRISSAs/People.

You said that

"For instance i can quote the incidence of bombardment on a Deeni Madrisa in Baajor, then an attack on a Madrissa in Wazeeristan area Data Khel, how many students got killed in those attacks from the security forces of Govt for unknown reasons".

I think now it cannot be called as UNKNOWN REASONS. There is very clear reason for all this activity. Why it is not happening at peaceful Madrissas of Lahore, Faisalabad, Rawalpindi and other cities? Why it is concentrated on a specific area. If we wish to close our eyes, we can. But reasons are known to our hearts. I have discussed these reasons so many times and dont wish to re-open this closed box.

I agree that killing by government was a big mistake but I never agreed that the terrorists should be allowed to do whatever they want and they should have been relieved and should have not been questioned for whatever allegations they bore.

I once earlier said that the things should have been tried to be settled by dialogues instead of killings. Government was in a position to do it. However, I cannot even think for forgiving the culprits. This is what HAZRAT MUHAMMAD PEACE BE UPON HIM said when he gave a decision on cutting the hand of a women accused of theft (subsequently proved). He said he (PBUH) would have not forgiven even if such an act had been done by his daughter FATIMA (Raziallahtala). {NAOOZBILLAH}.

Social crimes should not be forgiven. We have examples for it. We should not support any one just for the reason that government has done something wrong. I only call it wrong as I understand that Government could have done the operation peacefully, otherwise the concept of operation or arresting the accused is not wrong in my viewpoint. This was not to forgive. I am very much clear on it and by the way I am not that ROSHAN KHAYAL as you use this word for some people.

Still, this all is my viewpoint. I dont still support the idea of killing these poeple. I think government should adopt the way of dialogue to clean up these areas from militants. Wanted people should be arrested and innocents should be given full respect. Killings should be avoided from both ends.

You righly said that "Parties on both sides are lacking Ahsaas e Jurm".

All these are muslims and the resolution among them should not be a very difficult task.

Sorry if you feel some words against your concepts.

Best regards,

KAMRAN.

Imran · 07-24-2007, 07:54 PM

Mr kamran and Miss cool Lioness

I think this topic rather than are you in love with someone more corretly called Kamran vs Cool Lioness. I am much surprised how you people define things in such manners. By the way Both of you are one and same thing. Miss CL always says Kamran as a complex expressor what about your self? Both of you are true accountants. Sorry for my comments if any of you get hurt from these.

And Mr kamran by saying love is blind i didnot mean that there not exist other blind acts. My view is that Love doesnot want stipulations. It erases all the differences among the beloved parties. If you fall in love then you cannot specify some standards. Either the standards are natural or self made.

Regards
Imran

Cool Lioness · 07-24-2007, 08:09 PM

I dont feel it odd to proceed to foreign countries for earning. I took your words a bit sarcastic so i said so. Anyway no one over here in foriegn country is with an intention of living here for good. Secondly baat tou wohi hai jahan daana paani ho ga.....

See if a son of a labor today is minister tomorrow, dont you think that his chances to fall for a labor's daughter is much more expected then a son of minister yesterday and a common govt servent today? If labor son (minister today) likes some labor's daughter (he doesnt have to go to Kachi abadi to find her.), she will remind him his past days, past position (provided no-dolatiya kee tarah ocha na ho) and he wont feel it odd to marry a girl from Kachi Abaadi. Coz he knows that he himself is from the same background. He can also make his past as base to bring that girl to house. But yehi case minister ke son par applay karo. May be he will not even look at a labor' girl. Not because she is poor but because he needs an educated, confident woman beside her. This what he is used to now. He has criteria or he has his own choice that was developed in him in that environment where he opened his eyes. You would know better that there is huge difference between an educated , good respactable family back ground girl and an illiterate or very less educated (8-10 grd) financially low family girl. This change comes automatically in you. Any how this can be just one of the points when you fall for some one. ofcourse all love cases are different and have various reasons and issues and bla bla behind them.

I will reply later on coz i have got a lot of work on my table and ................... i am dead [(]

Regards

Imran · 07-24-2007, 08:16 PM

See if a son of a labor today is minister tomorrow, dont you think that his chances to fall for a labor's daughter is much more expected then a son of minister yesterday and a common govt servent today? If labor son (minister today) likes some labor's daughter (he doesnt have to go to Kachi abadi to find her.), she will remind him his past days, past position (provided no-dolatiya kee tarah ocha na ho) and he wont feel it odd to marry a girl from Kachi Abaadi. Coz he knows that he himself is from the same background.

I THINK ITS NOT FAIR MISS COOL LIONESS.

kamranACA · 07-24-2007, 10:52 PM

Dears,

Here we were not discussing what SHOULD happen in various scenarios. Rather, we were discusisng what typically happens around during our daily routine life. Always remember this is not a perfect world.

I think little bit difficult to digest.

Regards,

Kamran.

Cool Lioness · 07-25-2007, 02:11 PM

<blockquote id="quote">quote<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by kamranACA
 Dears,

Here we were not discussing what SHOULD happen in various scenarios. Rather, we were discusisng what typically happens around during our daily routine life. Always remember this is not a perfect world.

I think little bit difficult to digest.

Regards,

Kamran.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Bilkul we are not discussing that what should happen in different scenarios. Human nature is very complex. It changes time to time. So we are not going to discuss it further.

Actual topic ko tou kissi ne cherra hi nahin. Or may be we few guys doesnt have much to share on this topic.

Imran · 07-25-2007, 02:26 PM

So lets move on to main topic and leave discussion upon human psychology.