Double Standard of Pakistanis towards the foreign

[Schuaeb]

We can compare CA and ACCA on some objective and simpl basis.

You can blame CA as it is too tough, too lengthy, consumes the golden period of one's life and even after having wasted some precious years one can't be certain that he will manage to qualify. In fact, a very few manages to qualify.

Some people also say that ACCA course is more comprehensive than that of CA and its examination techniques are more practical. Although at they same time they agree to pass CA exams is much more difficult.

However, a qualified CA is supposed to be much more euipped with knowledge and skills and this is the result of tough qualification and training he has to pass through to come to that stage.

And no should be mistaken that a qualified CA is much more worthy than ACCA in the market at least at the moment. However, I can't say anything very much surely about future as the growing number of ACCA
may affect chartered accountancy.

I don't agree to the concept of being double standarded or giving preference to own resources by the country. A CA has to strugle much harder, so should get more rewards for his strugle.

Started in 1998 and dominated the world in very few years, this is ACCA is. You should look at this from another perspective, education is amongst the industries from which most income is being derived in UK. And the reason behind promoting ACCA is just it is a very big source of income for them.

[Muhammad Amir]

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Tahoma, Arial" id="quote">quote<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Some people also say that ACCA course is more comprehensive than that of CA and its examination techniques are more practical. Although at they same time they agree to pass CA exams is much more difficult.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></font id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
<font color="blue"><font size="4">Regarding above quote of Shoib i only say to him that focus on policies not on pass rates.....CAs exams is neither tough nor its difficult to pass contrary its difficult to pass just because of the fanatic approach of ICAPs policy makers(GURUS)....and see below illustration carefully without any prejudice...

ICAP has first Cost Accounting paper in Module D that is named as Cost Accounting bur our CAT's paper '4' Bachhas already studied infact more than Module Ds cost accounting...and this statement is not a misnomer not an over statement all the course books are easily avaiable therein you can go and compare CAT paper 4 with Module Ds Cost Accouting.

The second and the last paper relating to management acounting is introduced in Module 'F' so named as "F18 Management Accounting"...and for all of yours kind information i want to tell you that when i was in CAT paper '7' named as "T7 Planning Control and Performance Management" I nearly studied 70% of Module Fs paper F18 Management Accounting and the remaining 30% was related to paper 10...which was i left out in choice because of choosing Audit paper....and once again i invite you to go and compare.
D12 Cost Accounting with CAT paper 4 Cost Accounting &
F18 Management Accounting with paper 7 Planning Control and Performance Management...

So plese open you eyes see the truth with out any prejudice for any one....this is a request to all of you who are very keen to defend their ICAP...

Another Comparision which is very intresting here is that their are 3 papers of law in whole CA...likewise

Module B B5 Mercantile Law
Module D D10 Company Law
Module E E16 Corporate Laws

So comparing all three with only one paper of ACCA that is 2.2(Corporate and Business Law) and this is not my statement but of teachers of law that is ACCAs 2.2 course coverage is far much better than all 3 of CA...and this is not my statement but of those teachers who are authority in their subjects in both CA and ACCA...and one more interesting feature of ICAP is 3 law papers...but in contrast all other well known accountancy bodies are having only 1 law paper.I talk about well known accountancy bodies such as ICAI,ICAS,ICAWE,CIMA and others.....

and i show you something very ammazing see

in module F there are 4 papers overall

F18 Management Accouting
F19 Business Finance Decisions
F20 Advanced Taxation
F21 Adbanced Auditing
and we ACCA students,members and othe stakeholders are proud for having
Two Optionals
3.1 Audit and Assurance Services
3.2 Advanced Taxation
3.3 Performance Management
3.4 Business Information Management

All 3 CORE
3.5 Startegic Business Planning and Developmant
3.6 Advanced Corporate Reporting
3.7 Strategic Financial Management

so without prejudice you can see the more Indepth Course Coverage of ACCA compare to CA(ICAP).............

you don't need to beleive me neither i want you to only make your perceptions by my post challenge is open specially to "Mr KamranACA and Schoib" go and see the reality without ant presumptions without any prejudice....
and not only these aspects are ammazing i know 1000s of simmilar facts and i will discuss then upon the demands of public

Regards
Muhammad Amir</font id="size4"></font id="blue">

[Muhammad Amir]

<font color="maroon"><font size="6">And the last Golden Words i would like to say for all ICAPians that is

open you eyes see the reality don't follow your critiques but follow their statements...

Don't show your anger on ACCA because of dark ICAPs future this is all about self devotion and in modern world environment the only person who will be the winner is a Self less person, a self devoted person..so ACCA has both of them with them and I foresee in near future ICAPs whole maket will be blundered by ACCA which is already captured by CIMA and ACCA nearly 40%....see the reality it's easier to claim others but difficult to correct you selves...Criticism is very good and helthier activity but it should not for only the sake of your prestige but for the sake of knowledge and open eyes facts and evidences...
May Allah(S.W.T) give all ICAPians the way to think positive and accept the devotions of others..</font id="size6"></font id="maroon">

[nakaiun]

salam to all ca's and acca's
mr muhammad amir i m student of cat i have cleared two papers t1 and t2 inshallah in june i will give t5 one question that i would like to ask u after comleteing cat level 2 of acca become easy from june 2007 acca introduce new syllabus complete cat helps in former syllabus does it also help in new sllabus of acca

[nakaiun]

salam
wah wah amir bahi kay post kiya hay

[kamranACA]

Dears,

I just want to save the new entrants from making wrong decisions. Amir's baseless discussion dont affect me, it is his habit. I have given my views. Every one has mind and thought and should decide about him/her as per his/her own understanding.

GRAPES ARE SOUR for guys like Amir. He has so far failed to quote 15 to 20 big names from ACCA who dont have parallel CA qualification and are well settled icons of our profession in Pakistan. He is talking about Rs 30000 or so. He must quote big names in terms of knowledge, salaries, status, and exposure. Leave this 30000 circle please.

In fact I need not to get such comparison or information. I just want new comers to take good decisions.

Nothing esle.

Regards,

Kamran.

[Muhammad Amir]

You might be right and as per kamranACA sayings i only say that brother i infact posted 10s of time that please leave you prejudice out of your mind and think broader.
Mr KamranACA has criticised me on posting truth and challenging reallity for others he siad me that "I ALWAYS TALK BASELESS" so the answer for Mr KamranACA is please see what happened in above post from mine one mr SCHUEEB asked thah people are saying that ACCAs course is very good enough their Exam Techniques are absolute treamendous....but why people may not able to pass CA exams so for his criticism i replied him that ACCAs course coverage os 1000s of time better than those of the CA and then i compared ACCAs course with those of the Module Fs course...then i told him that ICAPs policies make all difficult to pass otherwise ICAPs course coverage is nothing.

As Mr KamranACA you also advised others that not to impress from my posts.....thats your own thoughts so please don't impose your thoughts on others please be carefull i am not posting here anything for the sake of my name but for the sake of my Profession.....know i also want to tell you that how can you say that i am baseless can you even prove my single stipulation which is baseless you can't because i only compared course outlined structure....and that can't be baseless all ACCAs and CAs books are easily available in markets go and see the differtance see the reallity....i didn't talk about any thing vague....

Also you said thah leave 30,000 beside so this 30,000 do not started by me it was your post which indicated that one person is getting 15,000 being an ACCA...in reply of this quote ni quoted that example of KESCs Cheif Accountant......

and as you need from me to tell you that ACCAs higher earning people so please go and consult with Statictics department they will better tell you about what is truth and what is wrong because i have no such records of what people are earning beside this i know 1 or 2 people who are only ACCA are earning 85,000 and 180,000 and 150,000 i know pwrsonally those people.....

Mr KamranACA and others please open your eyes see the reallity i am not talking about the examples of others world.....

Ok Mr KamranACA can you comment on the course comparision that i made then you might understand what i was talked about

Regards
Muhammad Amir

[kamranACA]

Dear Amir,

Your thoughts have always been child like. You always talk about exam techniques and ICAP behaviour etc. You must agree that you are still a confused student who knows nothing about the field but makes big prophecies and criticise all those things which have some times given you tough time or which you suppose would give you tough time.

Besides considering ICAP's syllabus extremely comprehensive at the moment, I also understand that basically we are a developing nation. I always say that in so many cases we have to follow the others. This is not the problem of Pakistan but whole muslim community at the moment. I in my previous posts agreed that ACCA and CIMA books are very good for study purpose. I also studied CIMA book written by R.J.Kirk on financial reporting in P.E.1. However, in professional qualifications, it is not the, available or published books, which make a difference. Rather, the difference is created by the quality of examination questions, honesty in declaring the students succeessful, difficult criterias, passing ratio and post qualification policies of the governing body/institute. Off course for having better you will have to put in better. Why not you agree to this universal truth. Further, it majorly depends upon the strength in a given economy and acceptability of a given qualification in terms of highest repute and status. I have no doubt that CA has no comparison with ACCA. It was, is and will always (inshallah) be better than ACCA, in my view, at least in Pakistan.

You must grasp the basic idea behind my communications. When poor parents work so much hard for the better future of their sons/daughters and such sons/daughters have to choose some field/qualification for poviding a return of the honest efforts of their parents then situation differs completely from your estimations. In such situation, behaviour of an institute, difficult exam techniques, comparison of syllabus and other such stuff has nothing to do with. The thing which matters is to get the best for fulfilling the wishes of all those who have worked on us honestly and to get the best of the bests in terms of future status. Off course CA is best for settling down in Pakistan.

Just suppose the example of some parents who worked life time hard for the better education and status of their son. And their son, just becoz of your wrong/baseless/child like discussions choose ACCA instead of CA even having calibre to qualify CA. And after doing ACCA he continues searching job for long times or gets some job which is not as per the dreams of his parents and which cannot even satisfy the basic expectation level. Then who will compensate such a student. Would you compensate? You can never. Very soon you would also be going to face it. I hope and pray that you find some good job to fulfill the noble wishes of your noble parents who have even prayed for you in HARAM SHAREEF. Yes, your knowledge in JAVA and other computer qualifications will help you but its credit must not be given to your so called ACCA.

You know the people who established ACCA were just like those who proposed and made efforts to establish PIPFA in Pakistan. I mean those who could not get ICEAW qualification and wanted to put something with their names. Their hews and cries have worked for them. However, with the passage of time, it has improved itself and this always happens every where. Now the issue that ACCA is finding wide acceptance. I can pass a smile on this news. Yes, they are increasing at least as students in Pakistan. Why? Has any body analyzed? Off course becoz it is considered much easier than CA. From this forum I have received e-mails of a guy who is feeling severe problem in getting through CA exams and wants to switch over to ACCA. Why it happens? Becoz every one knows that ACCA is easier and straightforward. Dear Amir, life is not so easy. If you only want to talk like a marketing man, you should choose MBA instead of this ACCA. It will work more for you. I bet.

As far s the issue of comparison of modle E or F or esle with ACCA. I just wish you to sit in the exam of E or F and have a courage to face these papers. You will come to know where does the difference lie.

In Pakistan, You have never worked in any senior capacity of our profession. You must know that in your age every one wants to have some short cut and searchs the easiest way to get something in the shortest possible time. This is what always make you to post such messages. Dont find satisfaction in calling others to ACCA just becoz you have to argue against CA in whatever circumstances. Every one including you knows that CA is better as far as Pakistan market is concerned. Then why you misguide the others.

I never impose my opinion on others. I always want the guys to do the best. If any body wants to do CFA instead of CA, I have no argument or objection. Off course it is much better in its own field and provides best retunrs. I have also no enemity with ACCA but when you will compare it with CA, specially in Pakistan, I will never agree with your thoughts.

Every one should find out reality before choosing a future qualification. All human beings have been created equal. If almost 5000 CAs have qualified, then why the new comer cannot qualify while God has created him equal to those who qualified. The thing which matters is courage and hard working.

I did not said "leave this 30000 circle" to avoid discussion. I said this to ask u to quote some big names earning 250,000 plus upto 1,000,000 plus as an ACCA without having parallel CA qualification.

Anyways, this is my last post on this topic. I wanted to save others from wrong decision but if any body wants to choose ACCA I dont have any objection personally. He will Inshallah find what destiny has written in his fate.

Regards,

Kamran.

[Muhammad Amir]

You have used you full potiential to cope with ACCA.....but in the end i say their is nothing to attract your posts...
In come instances you were right..but you had said that Poor Parents invest their Earnings and Savings in their Childs ..... Thats the point for which i say infact i advise to all parents that not to go for CA if you want greater Return on Investment(ROI) go for ACCA ....but if you have lot of time and lot of money to waste in CA go and join ICAP .... and you also said that Some students who didn't cope with CA they try to switch to ACCA ...yes you are right 100% right and i know 100s of people did this but could you tell me how many of these also attempt to pass their ACCA i know lot of people who left CA and switched to ACCA then ACCA also became nightmare for those students

I talked lot about the difference and i once again repeat "THESE ARE ICAP POLICIES THAT MAKE PEOPLE FAIL AND THESE POLICIES HAVE A GREATER IMPACT AND LOT OF SINCARE STUDENTS ALWAYS THINK THAT THEY ARE FAILURES BUT CONTRARY ITS ACCA WHICH HAVE NO DOMINANCY OF PRE DEVELOPED POLICIES AND WHO EVER COMKPLIES WITH THEIR CRITERIA WILL CERTIANLY A PASSED ONE"........

As you said that go and sit in Modules E and F exams ....so for your kind information in CAT paper 7 i did some past papers of F18 Management Accounting and that as certainly ammazed me that ICAP is having such a "HALWA" paper also in Module D's cost accounting paper is also very straight forward...... and i also analyse onie thing module Bs financial accounting is now under the influance of Frankwood..thats good very good this shows that ICAP is now turning to be more realistic...thats great

for you below statement
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Tahoma, Arial" id="quote">quote<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Dear Amir, life is not so easy. If you only want to talk like a marketing man, you should choose MBA instead of this ACCA. It will work more for you. I bet.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></font id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

I only say Laugh Out Loud.................

You are 100% Right that CAs are having great market exposure.....but this will not be the case in future(INSHA_ALLAH)....

[Astute Accountant]

<font color="blue"><font face="Comic Sans MS">I must say that if some 1 is confused, he or she would get much much more confused after going through this little "battle field".</font id="Comic Sans MS"></font id="blue">

[Astute Accountant]

<font color="blue"><font face="Comic Sans MS">What should 1 conclude from the above discussion??? That ACCA is recognized worldwide but in Pakistan it can't over take CA. Is it the final conclusion?
If it is so, I have mapped my future track 2 obtain exemptions on the basis of my foreign qualification 2 work in Pakistan.
Abb khush ACCA walay bhi aur CA walay bhi????Or still unhappy[)]</font id="Comic Sans MS"></font id="blue">

[Muhammad Amir]

the battle was not started for your happiness it was just to prove some uncovered facts

[kamranACA]

I am quite pleased to see the comments of members on this thread. Would any body have a look on following

ENGLAND

ACCA is behind ICEAW and cannot match it. However, it can find jobs in the market.

SCOTLAND

ACCA is least preferred over CA of scotland. However, it can find jobs in the market.

USA

ACCA is behind CPA and cannot match its grace. Locating jobs as ACCA is a bit difficult.

CANADA

ACCA is much behind CA and CGA. It cannot compete both of them. There is a difficulty to find out jobs for ACCA.

AUSTRAILIA

ACCA does not compete Aus CAs in Austrailia. One can check data of aus. Jobs could be located but have no comparison with CAs.

SAUDI ARABIA

CA from UK, CPA from USA and CA from Pakistan/India are preferred. Jobs are also given to ACCAs but in rare cases they are occupying top seats.

GULF AND UAE

CA from UK, CPA from USA, CA from India are preferred. CFA are also much preferred. CA from PAkistan are also settled in short number (major reason they find good remunerations in Pakistan and in UAE Indian CAs have reduced the market rates which are not acceptable). ACCAs also have good recognition in UAE and find jobs easily provided that indians dont compete them in any situation.

INDIA

There is a big number of indian CAs in india who dont even find jobs in their country and accept meager salaries internationally. ACCA also compete them but proportion of jobs and status of their jobs is nominal.

PAKISTAN

LOLZ. Every one knows.


ONE CAN JUDGE EVERY THING FROM ABOVE. IF ANYBODY HAS DOUBTS, HE SHOULD GO TO FIGURES AND FACTS NOT MERELY SPEECHES.

Best regards,

Kamran.

[Muhammad Amir]

I Salute to KamranACA Sahib what a great self made study...I think this is very cheap from the person like you to do these type of activity i once again say that ICAP gurus must think about ethics subject in some where in module D or E......

Can you prove what ever you wrote by anyones prestigeous study like accountancyAGE, or from BIG four articles.........

My dear this is not the good way to throw mud on ACCA...do something which attract people's attention...buit don't do things like this..

[msc286]

It is disheartening to see members of the forum to indulge in personal abuse instead of commenting on the situation in a professional way. One should have the courage and heart to listen to the view point of the others and then analyze that constructively.

By the way, I do agree with the opinion of the esteemed members that ACCA is yet not considered equivalent to CAs in Pakistan and it does not seem to change in the near future. I am a strong advocate that it's purely on the part of ACCA to undertake rigorous activities to get the due recognition in Pakistan.

Please note that my opinion is not biased in any sense. I am not only the member of ACCA but also a frequent faculty member for ACCA.

Regards,

Mahmood Chaudhry
ACCA, ACA