Future of Accountants ??

[Koolestboy]

Hi friends, hope i have choosen the right area to discuss this issue.

my question basically relate to graducates and lil related to masters etc

as we know accouting software are getting more n more dynamic as well as more n more easy to use , is this a replacement of an accountant to Data entry operator ? i am also working in a field , thats why i feel that with the guidance of the Manager Accounts , anyone would be able to perform general accouting functions wheather he is good with acounts or not.. wheather his study is in the same field or not..

2nd question is that , how would u feel when some institute teach acounting which is mostly practice in the firms ? like which type of documents is used, how to understand the softwares , how to manage the books and all and then those students jump into the field without the proper qualification and small firms can easily take the job..

I am also in touch with the IT field , dont u guys think that softwares in future will really replace the masters too .. like if the big firms hire about 20 people to manage accounts, forcasting , planning and all , that would shrink to 2 or 3 employees ?

may i sound foolish , may be very immature , but want to know the experts view

i am bcom graduate and currently enrolled to masters degree ..

Thanks.

[ausmanpk2001]

Well, I'm not an expert.

Dynamics of every professions & roles change as technology improves. As technology changes, more specialized & professional staff is in demand & clerical works are automated. As far as general accounting functions etc. writing up cash book, ledgers etc are concerned even in a manual system is no problem & any non accounting person can write the books with guidance of an accounting person in the beginning & then can take up the work.

Forecasting, planning etc. are specialized professional works & technology eases the work by doing lengthy calculations etc but doesn't replace the professional person rather complements it. Other than calculating formulas & generating reports, a lot of other things such as professional judgement etc. are required & that is the reason large companies pay hefty amounts to auditors, financial analysts etc.
As far as audit is concerned, computers cannot be a replacement of Auditors.

However, when the time comes when artificial intelligence is developed so much that there would be no need of professional judgment, thinking than there would be no need of doctors, engineers & accountants.

[Atifboss]

Dear professionals/students i want some guidence.....
me doing MBA-finance(3rd sem) from Arid agriculture uni.... my story is this that in 2005 i started doing CA from skans isbd i gave 3 attemps at that time i was able to pass only 2 papers of module A and 1 of B..... seeing that i left it and started doing Bcom got 65% in B com(punjab university) and now doing MBA...
my Age is 22 currently... i am missing that time alot though MBA is good degree but CA is CA... its toughness and hardwork is still helping me its 3 years now... i wana go back in orignal professional field... my quesition is that what u guys suggest me... cuz dil nai manta MBA mae 3.7+ CGPA hey per u know i cannot be like MBAs cuz i ve passed time with CA students and my attitude dos't match with MBAs me just like a bolt from the blue here... plz help me i also wana go abroad maybe UAE etc to get job... from where i need to start after doing MBA. cuz i have experience of CA toughness .... somebody told me about CFA i just want a genuin guidence beliving that u ppl are intact with professionals can guide me better ... wating u ur response...( know about ICMA that it gives examptions but wana do something lively in market)
regards
ATIF

[ausmanpk2001]

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, san" id="quote">quote<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Atifboss</i>
<br />Dear professionals/students i want some guidence.....
me doing MBA-finance(3rd sem) from Arid agriculture uni.... my story is this that in 2005 i started doing CA from skans isbd i gave 3 attemps at that time i was able to pass only 2 papers of module A and 1 of B..... seeing that i left it and started doing Bcom got 65% in B com(punjab university) and now doing MBA...
my Age is 22 currently... i am missing that time alot though MBA is good degree but CA is CA... its toughness and hardwork is still helping me its 3 years now... i wana go back in orignal professional field... my quesition is that what u guys suggest me... cuz dil nai manta MBA mae 3.7+ CGPA hey per u know i cannot be like MBAs cuz i ve passed time with CA students and my attitude dos't match with MBAs me just like a bolt from the blue here... plz help me i also wana go abroad maybe UAE etc to get job... from where i need to start after doing MBA. cuz i have experience of CA toughness .... somebody told me about CFA i just want a genuin guidence beliving that u ppl are intact with professionals can guide me better ... wating u ur response...( know about ICMA that it gives examptions but wana do something lively in market)
regards
ATIF
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></font id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

This sense of superiority in many CA STUDENTS (I haven't seen a full CA with this much superiority complex, only have seen CA students & part qualified CA'S thinking that they are better than others).
You don't even know or have the manners (which MBA/BCom/CA/FSc/O levels students have too)that you should make a new post rather than posting your questions in different posts & you think that you are superior than others! At least they have better manners & attitude than you! Just tell me one thing; were you like this from the beginning or starting CA entered this sense of superiority or maybe inferiority complex in you?

Excuse me, but what is so good about your attitude that makes you different from other MBA students? I've seen & worked with MBA's & CA's & found their attitudes absolutely OK. Its the person rather than the degree.

You should start doing CA again after MBA or else you'll be like this all your life thinking that you are different from your colleagues & bosses & that they are lower than. Better be with people you think are equal to you so that you can have better work relations & live a happy life instead of thinking all your life that you are a gem ruining in a basket of garbage.

My words maybe harsh, but this is a very good piece of advice for you; either come out of the superiority (or inferiority??) complex or get back into CA so atleast you'll be able to live happily with people equal to you.

If you have this type of attitude than it must be disturbing your personal life (friends etc) too. Think about that if you are having problems with friends or you are in problems with them frequently, this maybe the reason.

I've worked with lots of CA's/students/part qualifieds & have found them to be absolutely wonderful, its just some lot of people who have this type of superiority troubles, maybe its part of their inferior personality to think of others as lower than them in order to think better about themselves. Even your chosen id shows your superiority problems.

PS I'm not an MBA student & have no disputeS with ICAP -), rather I work with a chartered accountant firm.

[Atifboss]

ok,... u are right there are some people who are having the superiority in their mind... i feel u cannot understnad it cuz u hav't been with MBAs or personally a CA student... If It would be like this u shoud't have post this type of reply...
My question was not to give respect to CAs or saying MBAs are weak,.... just sharing u my experience that whats goin on with me... me not saying MBAs are not good or I am different
what i noticed is that.... MBAs dont wana Put their best as CAs need to... and when i ask my group memebers etc to work hard.... they dont do it cuz they say it is not required... where i feel it is required... problem is there may b i am wrong or they are... Its not that both are right...
By the way you are taking, taking this negatively.... i am adjusting myself, its not my comments its the faculty who feels it that you need to adjust with other students, try to change yourself and i am changing it ... i dont get hot that quick...
U notice that.... i am giving respect to those who make me fail even when i tried hard....and want to be like them... cuz i want to excel in life...
i dont take side of one.... what is goin on in market and waht i feel i am telling that... when an mba go for a job they say u are mba so be quiet and sit here... but when CA inter go there they say ok come one this sit is for u.... there is difference between what i noticed and goin on with these two. me openly sharing it, though its a personal thing...
and i was talking about work attitude, the attitude of putting ones effort at right time...
Sorry for this... dont know the rules of this site... cuz dont use this site much....whats my penaly?
ok...by the why thanks for your kind and hearty Reply
regards
ATIF

[ausmanpk2001]

Really sorry for the harsh words, recently I had interaction with some students who used to think that they are superior & others are inferior because of what they were studying, so I got a bit carried away.

On a side note, your style of communication, apologizing & thinking is a lot like one of my really very good friends. Your post reminds me of him!

[kamranACA]

Usman

Your reply was really sour in taste keeping in focus Atif's post.

You had always been a cool head. I really did not expect it from you. Anyway, it's good that things calmed down so swiftly.

Atif, we can understand your problem and hope you will get through this phase. Believe me CA is not that difficult. A committed effort can make the difference.

Is your university located at Rawalpindi; I guess I saw it during my recent visit on 15 Sep 09.

Regards,


Kamran.

[Atifboss]

yea Pir mehr Ali Shah Arid agiculture unversity is at the end of Staduium road on muree road, shamsabad rawalpindi,managment scicences department(UIMS)university institute of managment sciences is next to the rawalpindi art concil. so what are ur feelings after vising my uni?

[kamranACA]

Dear

My driver was actually driving from Islamabad to Rawalpindi crossing Faizabad Chowk and Chandni Chowk area when I probably saw this university.

The thing which I noticed was that the name of PIR MEHR ALI SHAH was written in a small font while ARID AGRICULTURE UNIVERSITY was written in magnified bigger font size the logic of which I could not understand.

I went to see one of the Embassy at F-6 (ISB) and not the University so cannot comment on it.

Regards,



Kamran.

[Koolestboy]

i was very happy when i saw 8 replies in my topic and then found that the posts inside are not related to the topic ..

too Bad.........

[kamranACA]

That's why it is called "Forum".

[kamranACA]

Koolestboy

I can't say with surety about western societies but in Pakistan, my observation is bit different than what we typically learn from books.

You try to find out some survey results or conduct survey of five six companies which shifted to automated systems in recent past.

What I feel is, the improved and improvised systems have caused entities to enhance the human resource, at least in the shorter run. In longer run, identification of such effects becomes quite difficult due to continuous growth of the entities which genuinly increases the demand.

Theoratically your question is valid, but practically, I am afraid results are different. Reasons may be investigated for behavioural reasons, attitudes, efficiency's measurement and analysis with some yardstick, and political reasons. Just for an example, in public sector the strengths once approved may not be possible to reduce due to involvement of politics and pressures.

We all know KalaBagh Dam is most feasible one, but we can never construct it.

I feel in majority of cases things are not materially affected. Rather, we have seen increase in HOUR in entities which implemented ERPs.

Regards,


Kamran.

[kamranACA]

In last sentence I wrote H.R and system converted it into HOUR.

[Atifboss]

Kambran sb,
Actually history of university how much i know is that... it was barani college and then shift to university of arid agriculture rawalpindi in 1994. Pir mehr ali shah sahb( golra shareef) contributed alot to make this college a uni.. so basically peer sahb was the one because of him this university name is remembered so its been 1 year the name of Arid agiculture university (barani university) was changed and now its PMAS-UAAR (pir mehr ali shah university of arid agriculture rawalpindi).... but because of pir sahb name its getting famous and renown... and it is noticed that after changing the name its gaining reputation in market.
I feel reason is this that to make prominent University name rather then the person... or from marketing point of view core product is university.

regards,

ATIF

[Atifboss]

Sorry koolest boy, its because of me,, i wana answer your question upto my limited obervation but feeling that Mr Kamrans point of view is almost right.
i worked in a reknown comapny in which ERP is intalled and i was working with a colleague who's duty was to upload budget and allocate budget for branches and he got all the IDs of Managers (managers have that much confidence on him) but you know you are talking about Data entered by anyone but u know decisions are made on the top level, Anyone can enter the data but cannot change it if he does't have authority... u know ERP is in process of installation so many errors occur where u need to consult the makers of software only the person who understands accounting can judge then whats wrong there... though as we know that there is difference between accounting and book keeping so this situation comes in front when there is problem... If at the place where i am talking about the person who loads and unloads budget keep checks on usage of budget do reporting etc just b anyone dont know about anything else but his work... so when problem will occure that person though could point the error/problem as sysem will tell but would not be able judge that why it is so or what it should be rather, unable to give accountants opinion and blank faced irritate higher authorities etc... on the other hand what i noticed he is always busy and continuously searching to find anything wrong there, thinks about that why it is wrong, find reason, what will be its correction and then he goes to higher authorities....
so its just observation that the person needs to b alert when he works on accounting software such as SAP,.... accouting knowlege is must... in goood situation anyone can work but when there is problem then onc can realize whats the importance of accountants then.

But u are talking about master will be replaced by automated systems... what i feel is that its same with everyfield look at engineers. they sit aside wait that when problem will occur in system then they will give their openion but youknow... computer is replacing man but only in those tasks which are repatative and lacking in deciosion making when there is point of making a decion Human mind is required there.
My favourit topic is Artificial intelegence... ive given presentation on it that.... in short is this that... when there is to make decision then U have to give baised input to system so that to make decision which is fair which human mind is feeling fair.... anythink cannnot work on its on but at some stage experts are required. its very vast topic(AI)... will take time.. so i think u got my point.(though efficiency is increased but its increasing stress and tension on employees too and not a 100% replacement)

regards

ATIF