Income from property, section 17 ITO & 155

[daneyal13]

I have some problems plz kindly help required.

1. Income from property is not under FTR now, what are its implications.

2. can we deduct expenses , is section 17 is omitted, is it become active now, can we claim refund after showing expenses . could we deduct utilities expenses.

3. how do we file return now, statement u/s 115(4), or u/s 114 now .

plz kindly also tell me the intricate details.

I will be much obliged.

BR//daneyal.

[LapTop]

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, san" id="quote">quote<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by daneyal13</i>
<br />I have some problems plz kindly help required.

1. Income from property is not under FTR now, what are its implications.

2. can we deduct expenses , is section 17 is omitted, is it become active now, can we claim refund after showing expenses . could we deduct utilities expenses.

3. how do we file return now, statement u/s 115(4), or u/s 114 now .

plz kindly also tell me the intricate details.

I will be much obliged.

BR//daneyal.
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1) Property income FTR may hi hay.

2) koi deductions allow nahi hay.

3) Statement U/S115(4) file ho gi.

[daneyal13]

actually sir problem arose in my mind when I read section 169(b) of the ITO updated upto july 2010 from fbr website where there is a tag #5 . the description of tag5 is "The word, digit and comma ;section 155,; omitted by the Finance Act, 2010".

plz kindly explain to me ,pg#219 , 169(b) .

[LapTop]

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, san" id="quote">quote<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by daneyal13</i>
<br />actually sir problem arose in my mind when I read section 169(b) of the ITO updated upto july 2010 from fbr website where there is a tag #5 . the description of tag5 is "The word, digit and comma ;section 155,; omitted by the Finance Act, 2010".

plz kindly explain to me ,pg#219 , 169(b) .
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Daneyal Bhai.
Confusion theek hay ap ki, asal may U/S169(b) may say 155 ko nikalny ki waja muhay ye nazar aati hay k property income ki calculation ha pora tarika U/S15 may detail say bataya gya hay is waja say U/S169 (b) may is ka zikar karna ghar zarori ho ga, ap sub-section 3 of section 169 parhayn us may section 15 ka zikar kar diya gya hay, or jo pabandiyan 169 may lagai gai han FTR ki income k liye wo sab pabandiyan section 15 may kafi detail say bata di gai han property income k liye.

Sada alfaz may ap ye samajh layn k FTR may job hi incomes han un may wahid property income aysi hay jis ki calculation ka tarika alahda say section 15 may bataya gya hay, baki kisi bhi income ki calculation ka tarika alahda say nahi bataya gya sab k liye section 169 ko follow karna pary ga, sirf FTR ki income ko withhold karny ka hi tarika bataya gya hay mukhtalif sections may.

[daneyal13]

THANKU SO Much Laptop bhai. im so very grateful.

[ejaz bhutta]

Dear Members,
It is nice to see such a fruitfull discussions here.
My understanding of the taxation of Income of Property is given as under

For the tax year 2010

A)Income from property at which tax has been deducted under section 155 shall be considered as FTR. As it is mentioned in section 155(2) (before omission by finance act 2010) that deducted amount will be final tax on such income.
B) If tax is not deducted under section 155 then such Income shall be taxed under NTR as there is no provision in section 15 regarding such income as Income under FTR. As regards section 169 as evident from its title, it deals with income at which the tax is collected or deducted as final tax therefore if there is no deduction at source from the income from property then section 169 becomes irrelevant.

For the Tax Year 2011

The income shall be assessed under NTR as the section 155(2) was omitted by finance act 2010.

Please correct me if there is any misunderstanding on my part, specially comments from Laptop bhai are awaited.

Thanks and regards

[LapTop]

Ejaz Bhai,
Bilkul sada alfaz may is bat ko is tarhan samjha ja sakta hay k jo pabandiyan Final Tax regime may lagai jati han U/S 169 wo sari pabandiyan U/S15 may lagai gai han property income par,

Normal tax regime may jo adjustment or credit allow hoty han wo property income k liye allow nahi han.

[ejaz bhutta]

Dear Laptop bhai,sorry as I did not got your point.. jahan tak meri understanding hay, U/s 15 read with section 56, there is no provision which expressly pohibits the adjustment of the property income at which tax was not deducted u/s 155 and loss incurred under any other head except capital loss and speculation loss. Meray khyal main Income u/s 15 is proper head of income u/s 11 and not separate class income as mentioned in u/s 4 about Income u/s 5,6,7 although the nature is same. Aur meri understanding k mutabiq classification of Property income u/s 11 as head of income may be construeded that the same can be used to adjust loss as provided u/s 56.

Thanks And regards

[LapTop]

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, san" id="quote">quote<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by ejaz bhutta</i>
<br />Dear Laptop bhai,sorry as I did not got your point.. jahan tak meri understanding hay, U/s 15 read with section 56, there is no provision which expressly pohibits the adjustment of the property income at which tax was not deducted u/s 155 and loss incurred under any other head except capital loss and speculation loss. Meray khyal main Income u/s 15 is proper head of income u/s 11 and not separate class income as mentioned in u/s 4 about Income u/s 5,6,7 although the nature is same. Aur meri understanding k mutabiq classification of Property income u/s 11 as head of income may be construeded that the same can be used to adjust loss as provided u/s 56.

Thanks And regards
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Is ko samajhny k liye ap ik kaam karyn, annual income tax return k Colum No.65. (Property Income Subject to WHT) may 300000 ka amount dalyn, to system automatically tax 7500 nikal day ga.
Ab ap farz karty howay k is person ki 300000 ki 1 or property income hay jis par tax withheld nahi howa,
Ye 300000 ka amount ap Colum No.76 (Property Income Not Subject to WHT) may dalayn or daykhay k system kya tax calculate kary ga,
System is amount par 20000 tax calculate kary ga, wo dono income ko add kar k 600000 k hisab say ap ka tax 27500 bana day ga,
Is say ap ko samajhny may aasani ho gi.

[ejaz bhutta]

Thanks for clarifications. lakin meri confusion specifically yeh hay k Income from property same year k loss from business say set off q nehen ho sakti, Practice main aisa nehen ho raha na he RETURN Ka Prescribed Formate is ko fascilitate kerta hay, lakin mujay ITO, 2001 main koe aisi baat nazar nehn ayi jis say yeh clear ho k yeh prohibited hay under the law

Thanks again for quick response

[LapTop]

Is ki waja ye hay k property income ho sakti hay sirf Property loss ho hi nahi sakta,
Loss to us sorat may ho ga k ap ko deductions allow hon income may say, par aap property income may say koi expanse less nahi kar sakty, to loss ka to sawal hi payda nahi hota.

[ejaz bhutta]

I am sorry lagta hay main bat convey neh ker payaa

1)Income from Property is separate head of income u/s 11 , Calculation is discussed u/s 15,16 there is no possibility of loss as it is on deemed income ie gross amount of rent and no deductions allowed
2) Income from Bussiness is a separate head of income u/s 11 and calculation is dicussed u/s 18 to 36. Loss may be there in any year.

3)Setting off of losses under different heads is discussed u/s 56 which does not disallow the set off of losses from business with property income as the same is not under FTR if the deduction u/s 155 s not made