kHALID bHAI PLEASE LISTEN

[sajidkhani]

Khalid bhai and all other people who say that ICAP is a group of group of narrow minded people and who dis-like ACCA . Please notice tah ICPAP has been established to give CPA qualification in PAKISTAN,and interesting thing is that these CPA`s dont have the right of audit of PLCs`. The Liason department officials have told me on phone that ICAP has argued that in PAKISTAN there is no need of these CPAs`
Please comment kia CAs` K hote huae Kisi aur ki Zarorat nahe hai, Kia CA walley Economy Ki khidmut itni achi ker rahe hen?

[mroneflower]

Dear sajidkhani

Thanks for your post.

I have been saying for a while poeple just wait for few yrs and see what happen to ICAP. In todays morden world ICAP cannot use law to protect itself. Y ICAP is saying that in the presense of CA from ICAP there is no need for CPA(pak) to have audit right. You can see reason behind it. Actually ICAP is afraid of competition, but ICAP has to face competition one day.

Someone told me CPA(Pak) is just like UK AAT or CAT, but you are saying totally opposite. I have not seen contents of CPA(PAK) qualification, but if CPA(PAK) is seeking audit status in Pakistan then I am sure they will get it in future.

Just wait for few yrs and see what happen to ICAP, ACCA is in Pakistani market, ICAEW will be there soon and now CPA(Pak).

I will check CPA (PAK) web site to find out when it was established and what is its purpose.

Khalid

[mroneflower]

I just checked the web site, CPA(PAK) launched it qualification in Pakistan in 1994 and its SYLLABUS looks fine as they do have advance auditing, advance tax, advance accouting papers. Moreover its look from CPA(PAK) web site that CPA(PAK) members are also CFA means CPA(PAK) members are eligibled to register with CFA. Remember ACCA affliciate and ICAP membership can also register with CFA without any exemption. So its means CPA(PAK) has equal standing outside Pakistan which ICAP has.

I think ICAP is going to have tough time. I think CPA(PAK) will be allowed to do audit of plc. It will also be good for Pakistan as more competition means better quality accountants and work.

Moreover to register with CPA(Pak) one need to have at laest graduates whereas to register with ICAP one need to be inter so entry requirement of CPA(PAK) is better than ICAP.

Trust me ICAP will not be able to force Pakistani government, for long, not allow CPA(PAK) to audit plc in Pakistan.

CPA(PAK) qualifiaction structure is almost same which ACCA had before 2000. CPA(PAK) also have 14 papers. Are you getting my point. I cannot be more clear in my words at this point of time.

Khalid

[mroneflower]

Dear sajidkhani

Do you have any other informtion about CPA(Pak).

Khalid

[mroneflower]

I found CPA(PAK) is not member of IFAC. Does this institute exist in real. They do have web site,they also reply to emiails and claims that <b>Yes, we have taken the matter before FBR Minsitry of Fianance and Commerce, AGPR and the same is in process.</b>
But how come they are not member of IFAC.

Khalid

[sajidkhani]

Khalid bhai, if ICPAP was established in 1994 and as we know that as yer they have not got the right of audit,then they will not succeed in their negotiation process with FBR. And they have been established quite recently then there is some chance but if ICPAP was established in 1994 how it is possible that it remained out of knowledge of Kamran ACA and PRACS and other senior members of this forum. The whole situation is a bit foggy,do you agree ?

[mroneflower]

Dear sajidkhani

ICPAP was formed in 1992 and launched CPA programme in 1994. It has 250 members. This information is given by ICPAP on its web site. I seriouly thinks that 18 yrs (as it introduced it squalification in 1994) is not long period.

It takes time to get audit recognition. However, I am not sure about ICPAP legal status. We cannnot say that it is fake or real institute as it was only established in 1992. Someone need to check it with FBR or Govt of Pakistan about ICPAP legal status. I am not in position to say whetaher is fake or real.

Khalid.

[danishjaleel]

HI guys,
I am addressing the Same issue that either CAP (pak)is the recognised certificate or not....and what is the future of CPA(Pak) and and how we compare with this to other CPA USA
As comes to the correspondence with the IMRAN (ICPAP-office)as below,,

[<i>b]Dear , Thank you for your email.

1) For Membership kindly send us copies of your all educational documents,experience certificates, registration, exemption, membership forms(download our website) along with fees Rs. 37,500/= via pay order or crossCheque in favoring of ICPAP for following address Institute of Certified Public Accountants of PakistanSuit No 410, 4th Floor, Royal Centre, Fazal-ul-Haq Road, Blue Area,Islamabad. Tel +92 51 430 5497.

2) Yes, CPA is a registered body in pakistan.The Institute of CertifiedPublic Accountants of Pakistan (ICPAP) was established as a non profitsociety under license of the Federal Government of Pakistan granted byRegistrar Joint Stock Companies under Societies Registration Act of XXI of1860 in June 1992. We wish you all the best in your search of knowledge. For further clarification please do let us know.

Regards, Imran.[/b]</i>

[hanifasif]

Out of curiosity, the other day I phoned them, and to my utter disappointment, the guy giving the info was soon out of his depth. When I said your institute does not have any legal backing like ICAP and ICMAP and to this he retorted, "Have you ever read Companies Ordinance, 1984 it gives us all the powers that makes us at par with ICAP and ICMAP.” I said then why your members don’t have the powers to conduct audit and all that, and in reply to this he just babbled.

He further informed me that I am entitled to full exemptions for CPA certification and all I needed to do was to submit my docs with fee.

Dont waste your money. It appears to me that ICPAP is just to defraud aspiring accountants.

[Mujahid]

Agreed with hanifasif. Here is something which I read on ICPAP website.

<b>The CPA Program offered by ICPAP is different in design, structure, scope, content and examinations from the CPA Program offered by the American Institute of Certified Public Accountants (AICPA), USA and others countries of the world. The ICPAP and AICPA are independent of each other, and there are no reciprocal arrangements. All reference to the CPA Program in this document pertains to the CPA Program offered by ICPAP only.</b>

Source http//www.icpap.com.pk/CPAHistory.html

[awaisaftab]

I think it is unbelievable that ICPAP will get the righ of audit of PLC's . It is a new institute and I think its members will be in dozens whereas ICMAP has thousands of members who hold high designation in private and public organization ICMAP was established in 1951 but still ACMA's have audit right to do the audit of private limited companies with a paid up capital of 3 million. So how we can imagine that a newly extablished institue having only some dozen members can acquire audit rights.

Regards,

Awais Aftab

[K.Ahmed]

Dear All

Why are you comparing ICPAP with ICAP?? i think we should compare ICPAP with ACCA... Can someone tell me what is the status of ACCA in Pakistan??? are they allowed to conduct audit in Pakistan??...what is their legal status in Pakistan....what ACCA has is just reputation because of it's strong and highly updated course outline..which comes with time only..ACCAians can't legaly conduct audit in Pakistan as well...but still it's much more popular in Pakistan and worldwide....can someone tell me how many students of ACCA were there in 1994 in Pakistan... In 1998 i was student of ICAP and studying at CAMS....we had only one student of ACCA at CAMS...ACCA was having a one room office in Karachi..Mr. shariq mateen was answering the same questions....when i confirmed with my cousin in UK about ACCA....He said it's quiet popular here but legally ICAEW has more advantage....i am not sure about its future....

Same discussion we, as a students of ICAP, were having at that time to join ACCA or not....at that time its syllabus was much more easier than ICAP....we were suppose to clear 7 papers at a time in ICAP but in ACCA we can do it one by one....people use to make fun of ACCA that it's a one room body....and will runaway soon....ICAP will not let it stand for long....afterwards ICAP cancelled the exemption for ACCAians to give it tough time....

Then what happened guys????...ACCA made history in Pakistan....highest growth of ACCA students was recorded in Pakistan... ICAP had to change and ease it's syllabus due to ACCA....ACCA is still successfull even without having audit status in Pakistan....it's members are working on key positions in Pakistan and are very successfull....

GUYS wake up ! ICPAP is a potential body in Pakistan...there is a big demand of finance executives....why an international body like ACCA is needed in Pakistan??? because ICAP is not able to complete the market demand....ICAP concentrate on audit(only) in Pakistan(only)....what about finance industry???...MBA finance can still not compete in finance industry....We need this body???....I know ICPAP is giving complete exemption to professionals....which is a big question mark on their reliability...but i think it's a sensible move if followed with sincerety...why??? this is the only way to promote a society....professionals are already on key positions and have knowledge...by this way they are skipping a long process to create professionals and waiting for them to get recognized in the market...OK let me ask you ! How do you get impressed with ICAP???? when u see finance director of PSO is FCA....tomorrow if he also gets membership of ICPAP then we have a readymade CPA on a key position.....when ICPAP will have only 1,000 key professionals in Pakistan and worldwide....your views will definitely change !

My only demand with ICPAP is that they should continue to be sincere and honest....otherwise there is no problem with ICPAP....It's our responsibilty to promote our body...not to just pin-down it...In the end i want to ask all of you....IF UK CAN HAVE 3 AUDIT BODIES THEN WHY CAN'T WE HAVE IN PAKISTAN????

I am seeing so much discussions about ICPAP on accountancy forums and i beleive this the first successfull step.....
There is nothing to loose to join ICPAP...what we get is a strong chance to get recognized soon !

......
Do lakht hai jigar, phir bhi hai mojoodgi ka ahsaas
Qurbaniyoo ka shehr hai yeh, abhi tou khona kuch oor baqi hai
manzil pe puhunch ker khoosh hota hai jehel
yeh tou shroowaat hai, rasta abhi kuch oor baqi hai
sazishein hain buhut magar phir bhi hai khudi ka ahsaas
ab ho jo dard mahsoos lagta hai zindagi kuch oor baaqi hai
........

Sab Humwatnoo ko
AZADI MUBARAK !

[kamranACA]

I will just ask the ADMIN to be-aware of re-enTries of "mroneflower"

Regards,


KAMRAN

[danishjaleel]

Glad to see your views and detail reply…..

I think we were on the same boat, when ACCA launch in CAMS...
I am recalling your memories that ACCA not distribute certification on simple experience or MBA etc...,, They have some papers 14 papers and maximum exemption for only 5 papers on Masters.

Pease DON’T compare the ACCA with CPA,(Pak), as they formed in 1904.
Even ACCA have atleast accreditation and exemptions to ICAEW, on completion....means to sit for few papers of ICAEW...

We all don’t want to pin down the ICPAP, but to drill down….”)

Atleast, as a forum member, looking forward some area of exemption from ICAP, which will make assurance that ICAP (CA - Pak) have link to accept in the Local market (means inside Pakistan)

Secondly, we will also looking for any across border body’s acceptance or any part exemption that shows CPA is the valid certificate, as they already completed there 18 years of journey.…..

Even I am in the queue in order to taken the qualification, but before we all make sure about that “<b>What we want and going to achieve, It’s a same what we have an AIM”.</b>




<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, san" id="quote">quote<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by K.Ahmed</i>
<br />Dear All

Why are you comparing ICPAP with ICAP?? i think we should compare ICPAP with ACCA... Can someone tell me what is the status of ACCA in Pakistan??? are they allowed to conduct audit in Pakistan??...what is their legal status in Pakistan....what ACCA has is just reputation because of it's strong and highly updated course outline..which comes with time only..ACCAians can't legaly conduct audit in Pakistan as well...but still it's much more popular in Pakistan and worldwide....can someone tell me how many students of ACCA were there in 1994 in Pakistan... In 1998 i was student of ICAP and studying at CAMS....we had only one student of ACCA at CAMS...ACCA was having a one room office in Karachi..Mr. shariq mateen was answering the same questions....when i confirmed with my cousin in UK about ACCA....He said it's quiet popular here but legally ICAEW has more advantage....i am not sure about its future....

Same discussion we, as a students of ICAP, were having at that time to join ACCA or not....at that time its syllabus was much more easier than ICAP....we were suppose to clear 7 papers at a time in ICAP but in ACCA we can do it one by one....people use to make fun of ACCA that it's a one room body....and will runaway soon....ICAP will not let it stand for long....afterwards ICAP cancelled the exemption for ACCAians to give it tough time....

Then what happened guys????...ACCA made history in Pakistan....highest growth of ACCA students was recorded in Pakistan... ICAP had to change and ease it's syllabus due to ACCA....ACCA is still successfull even without having audit status in Pakistan....it's members are working on key positions in Pakistan and are very successfull....

GUYS wake up ! ICPAP is a potential body in Pakistan...there is a big demand of finance executives....why an international body like ACCA is needed in Pakistan??? because ICAP is not able to complete the market demand....ICAP concentrate on audit(only) in Pakistan(only)....what about finance industry???...MBA finance can still not compete in finance industry....We need this body???....I know ICPAP is giving complete exemption to professionals....which is a big question mark on their reliability...but i think it's a sensible move if followed with sincerety...why??? this is the only way to promote a society....professionals are already on key positions and have knowledge...by this way they are skipping a long process to create professionals and waiting for them to get recognized in the market...OK let me ask you ! How do you get impressed with ICAP???? when u see finance director of PSO is FCA....tomorrow if he also gets membership of ICPAP then we have a readymade CPA on a key position.....when ICPAP will have only 1,000 key professionals in Pakistan and worldwide....your views will definitely change !

My only demand with ICPAP is that they should continue to be sincere and honest....otherwise there is no problem with ICPAP....It's our responsibilty to promote our body...not to just pin-down it...In the end i want to ask all of you....IF UK CAN HAVE 3 AUDIT BODIES THEN WHY CAN'T WE HAVE IN PAKISTAN????

I am seeing so much discussions about ICPAP on accountancy forums and i beleive this the first successfull step.....
There is nothing to loose to join ICPAP...what we get is a strong chance to get recognized soon !

......
Do lakht hai jigar, phir bhi hai mojoodgi ka ahsaas
Qurbaniyoo ka shehr hai yeh, abhi tou khona kuch oor baqi hai
manzil pe puhunch ker khoosh hota hai jehel
yeh tou shroowaat hai, rasta abhi kuch oor baqi hai
sazishein hain buhut magar phir bhi hai khudi ka ahsaas
ab ho jo dard mahsoos lagta hai zindagi kuch oor baaqi hai
........

Sab Humwatnoo ko
AZADI MUBARAK !
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></font id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

[danishjaleel]

Glad to see your views and detail reply…..

I think we were on the same boat, when ACCA launch in CAMS...
I am recalling your memories that ACCA not distribute certification on simple experience or MBA etc...,, They have some papers 14 papers and maximum exemption for only 5 papers on Masters.

Pease DON’T compare the ACCA with CPA,(Pak), as they formed in 1904.
Even ACCA have atleast accreditation and exemptions to ICAEW, on completion....means to sit for few papers of ICAEW...

We all don’t want to pin down the ICPAP, but to drill down….”)

Atleast, as a forum member, looking forward some area of exemption from ICAP, which will make assurance that ICAP (CA - Pak) have link to accept in the Local market (means inside Pakistan)

Secondly, we will also looking for any across border body’s acceptance or any part exemption that shows CPA is the valid certificate, as they already completed there 18 years of journey.…..

Even I am in the queue in order to taken the qualification, but before we all make sure about that “What we want and going to achieve, It’s a same what we have an AIM”.