"OUR" ISLAM

javed · 11-24-2007, 02:02 PM

I am grateful to ALLAH the Great that I am a Muslim. I am satisfied that I am to a good extent a true Muslim. I am not an orthodox nor a liberal as there is no such classification in Islam. My family five time prays. My wife and daughter sometime go out in full hijab sometime just merely having a âdupataâ. I do not just for fashion to show myself liberal educated criticize Mullah rather I respect them that they struggle, though in their own way and under their own interpretation, for implementation of Islamic rule. I have great regard for Islamists that till today this nation has not heard any fraud, scandal or any low character thing about these Mullahs. But at the same time I pray that ALLAH the Great may not bring them on Rule otherwise they will make us hell.

I have never accepted that Islam exists in arab countries particularly in Saudi Arabia. To me Islam only is in Pakistan, India, Iran, Bangladesh, Malaysia etc etc. Saudis are the worst in all respect may it be religious thoughts or human behaviours with others. I have lived in between them for 20 years. There are two news items from this fortnight which must be of interest to the readers. First one A Saudi divorced his wife because when he came to home he saw his wife view TV alone on which screen was a male âna-mahramâ. Second One Three Saudis gang raped a women. The culprits have been jailed from one year to three years. But the victim was too awarded 90 lashes as she was found guilty of âsittingâ in the car with ânamahrumsâ who raped her. The case went to appeal court which increased the lashes to her 200 for the sin why did she spread her rape to press. Ministry of Justice has summoned the lawyer defending the raped victim asking him to explain why his lawyers licence should not be suspended for defending such a women. I can not understand why we blame the West if they laugh on Muslim on basis of what Islam we practically present to the world.

PS In the afternoon I typed it for posting. In the evening I was reading an Arab newspaper survey in which an arabian human rights group has warned the soceity the repercussions on ill treatment with foreign house maids. The survey stated in most the cases employers are giving left over food to these poor maids. Since I have lived amongst them I believe this as I myself have seen this. 50% of too poor housemaids from India, srilanka, indonesia, philipplines are not given full food, job is taken 20 hours a day with no single day off, housemaids sleep in kitchen etc. That is my it is my firm belief Arabs are not Muslim.

Muhammad Amir · 11-25-2007, 08:15 PM

Mr Jawed you have written...

<blockquote id="quote">quote<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"> But at the same time I pray that ALLAH the Great may not bring them on Rule otherwise they will make us hell.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Please clarify this line. It Will be your EHSAN on me...

secondly you have written
<blockquote id="quote">quote<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">A Saudi divorced his wife because when he came to home he saw his wife view TV alone on which screen was a male âna-mahramâ. <hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

That Saudi did wrong, I wonder who was the one that provided her this T.V(TB)...Probably that man himslef bought the T.V, now their is no "JAWAZ" to divorce her i think that man should be hunged up and government should give him death sentence because he did two wrongs firstly he bought T.V in his home then he divorced his wife(I don't think that sanity exist in that person). Dear Jawed I don't know how people like you start appraising whole society on the wrong deeds of few people..

<blockquote id="quote">quote<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">The case went to appeal court which increased the lashes to her 200 for the sin why did she spread her rape to press.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

As i have no proper understanding of Islamic punishments therefore i can't comment in this, however i must say that After "AMARAT-E-ISLAMIA Of AFGHANISTAN", Saudi Arabia is the only country having some islamic laws wokring, SAUDI SHARIE-ADALATAIN are the providing speady and full justice to people, have you met with the person who have increased this punishments. Have you asked him about the law in compliance of which he has given this punishment probably you didn't...

<blockquote id="quote">quote<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">That is my it is my firm belief Arabs are not Muslim.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Deeds of few people can't be a representative of full majority and you can't do QAYAS of full population by seeing the deeds of minority you should not write this sentance please delete it...

Regards,

Muhammad Amir

Sarfaraz · 11-26-2007, 02:04 PM

AOA

Mr. Javed pahly to Amir bhai ki baton ka jawab do

phir mujhe yeh batana k according to statistics ap ne 2 samples select kiye aur unhain millions ki populations par apply kar diya

1- Pahlay yeh batain k yeh samples kia total population k true representative hain?
2- Kia ap islam ki basics ko jantay hain? Kia ap ko pata hai k parday k baray main Quran kia kahta hai aur Rasul ALLAH sale la hu alehe wasalam ka farman kia hai?
3- kia ap ko pata hai k sahabiyat kaisa parda karti thee?
4- Agar Arab muslmaan nahi hain to kaan khol kar sun lo k duniya main kahi bhi muslmaan nahi coz Rasul ALLAH ne farmaya (Sahi muslim kitab ul emaan)

Islam ajnabiat ki halat main aaya aur anqareeb ajnabi ho jaye ga to ajnabiyo k liye tooba(khushkhabri) hai
aik aur riwayat main aisay milta hai k islam simat kar makkah aur madina main aa jaye ga

so Quran arabi main hai Rasul ALLAH ka farman arabi main hai aur arabi ko woh log hum ajmiyo se bahter jantay hain
shayad ap ka dimagh yahan k ajmiyo ne kharab kia hai

kamranACA · 11-26-2007, 06:06 PM

Dears,

The words written by Javed about Saudi Arabia are bit harsh as I always say that we should not declare any one non-muslims at our own accord. Islam does not permit us to do so. If we will do this would be the reciprocal wrong act.

However, I have met almost more than ten persons who have lived at Saudi Arabia for reasonable time and who all give similar to Mr. Javed's opinion about the rules, law enforcement, reasonability and biases of Saudies for non-saudies. Recently some issue got popularity in news papers (at Punjab) where some family brutally treated by Arabs came back to Pakistan and gave their interviews to newspapers etc.

This has nothing to do with Islam as such becoz this is behaviour of a nation. Yes, of course Saudi Arab might be doing so much very good as they are managing big events like Hajj for muslims very effectively and always have been very much responsible for it. I dont talk about Hajj but can anybody ensure such security, safety and system, if we wish to have a get together of such a huge qunatum at Pakistan, Iran or India? We should give them credit. Good should be appreciated and bad should be criticized.

As far s their general nature is concerned, Arabs have ever been alike. Islam has not so much changed their nature. This (and Iraqies) are the same nation which caused all the bad fame to Islam in the earlier days. I am not hiting faith of any one. This is just to think about what they have done and what they do. There all funds are with christians and jewish banks. They are from among the closes friends of USA at the moment. They have done similar to Musharraf acts when they handed over their land to USA against Iraq. Kuffaar did the worst things on the land of Arab due to these saudies. So much is bad is likely to be declared bad.

Socially speaking, it is a reality that Saudi Arabians dont like ajmies. They dont lose their biases (what I have heard) and keep on hating others with reference to color, caste, location and origination. Of course they are not the big example of true muslims at the level of masses. Some people would certainly be very good. And dont much talk about justice at Saudi Arab please. Ask about this justice from some one who has evidenced it. These are not just some instances, as you Sarfraz and Aamir declare it as remarks on Javed's post.

I think to know in detail and with further accuracy, we should look up to those who have lived at Saudi Arabia and not those who have just visited it. Mr. Shoaib (at this forum) is one of such person. I think we should seek some details from him as well.

However, on hearing so much about Saudi Arbia, I have made a firm opinion that one should visit Saudi Arabia for Umrah or Hajj purpose or for religious study tours but not for permanent stays or job etc.

Lets see what the comments come from those who really have lived at Saudi Arabia.

Regards,

Kamran.

Schuaeb · 11-27-2007, 01:13 AM

I have lived in KSA for 17 years, though those were the days of my childhood and boyhood.

Without specifically commenting on any particular example given by any of you, I have, at a lot of places heard about racial and gender discrimination and moral corruption of Saudis. In addition, Arabs are also considered as culprits of Muslim nation (if it exist at all), as they were the blessed one with natural resources.

I have not heard any of such examples as Javed mentioned, however, it never means that I am denying those. Such things are possible over there and he must have posted on the basis of some concrete information. Provided these are the facts (as mentioned in the example quoted by Javed), we (muslims) are ourselves giving a chance to Western human right activists to highight gender discrimination in our societies, and more regrettfully they are justified in doing so.

Freedom of speech or sect, these terms must be alein to Saudi nationals, discrimination of the basis of race is a common phenomena. An American doing the same work as a Pakistani is paid three time more (even more than nationals). The kafil system, now what to say about that. Every thing to exploit people from third world exist in their legal system.

But we should look at ourselves too. Even in this situation (as mentioned) I believe that Saudis are at least better than us humans, morrally as well as socialy. Thier system has got a number of positive points too.

Saudia, I don't think is a recommendable country for job or permanent stay, reason being their market is almost saturated plus their policies are not suitable.